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Thread started 08/22/18 12:39pm

Krystalkisses

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Did Prince make a faustian pact to attain all he did in life?

It's kinda a big question and may open up a whole can of worms, but I'm going to ask it anyway, because I've been thinking about it lately and it has been bothering me. I'd argue that Prince is a once in a lifetime artist, maybe the last one inspiring such awe was Mozart, so even non-fans think his creativity, talent and genius were unmatched by any peers...so I think we can all agree what a rarity he was. He reached the mountain top and had access to all the worldly pleasures that came with that.

It makes me think of the Robert Johnson story, where he made a deal with the devil in exchange for his talent. Although not exactly because there wasn't a sudden improvment in ablility, creativity or talent, people saw this in Prince when he was very young.

I'm not suggesting an actual devil came to Prince and offered him a deal obviously, but more it is a spirtual tumble, when you are young , the things that you think are going to fill you up -sex, fame, money, admiration-don't really and are not soul noruishing in the least. I guess many people never figure that out but I do believe Prince did.

One of the most facinating stories since Prince's death was the Tavis Smiley story about Prince talking to him after Michael Jackson's death how they had some deep, discussions since they were both JWs and how it was possible to balance that or even exist when you are in their position in the world and at their level , at the mountin top. Obviously they could relate to eachother , regarding fame and trying to honor God or the spiritual.

More like is their something about fame, that lifestyle that messes with you mind and resolve that almost makes it impossible to truely lead a viruous life? Like how in the Bible it talks about how it is difficult for a rich man to get into heaven. When you are around a morally corrupt enviroment/people and trying to be a good person...it just seems like pushing a boulder up a hill...

...and for all Prince's faults and shortcomings I have to say at least he had the heart, wisdom and compassion to bring spiritual issues to the forfront in popular music/culture. Which is more than I can say for almost any other artist.

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Reply #1 posted 08/22/18 2:04pm

PeteSilas

people said that when he was young, in his prime, mark brown said crazy things about not being able to see Prince's reflection in the mirror and Charlemaine said he saw Prince levitate. Part of it was his mystique but I really feel that Prince, if anything, never got away from the indoctrination of his youth and in some ways I'm sure it hurt him like it hurts many of us. Christianity is repressive, a fucked up religion, he rebelled against it but never left it really. Anyway, no, i don't think he would deal in evil but maybe he would. Vanity said some crazy shit about demons too. As P got older, he became more normal seeming and decent, in fact, he was always conservative. He only got moreso as he became older. So, i guess it's possible for him to be involved in that type of stuff but I don't thinks so.

Prince.org: With fans like these he didn't need haters.
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Reply #2 posted 08/22/18 2:39pm

RJOrion

i believe he did...i believe many of the "superstar" entertainers do make some type of deal, whether with seen or unseen forces, there are too many stories throughout history, from the mouths of many insiders to deny that there is some truths to the notion that the entertainment industry is run by "people" who use the dark arts and the supernatural to make deals with, and control some of their artists... more than one person who was close to Prince throughout his life has made references to this...whether it was Morris Day's mother saying P was evil...even his sister calling him "The Prince Of Darkness"...Owen Husney implying he must have made some type of deal with the devil... to his cousins and aunties scaring him with Ouija boards when he was little... there is a reason why alot of these successful entertainers turn to religious fanaticism when their careers are winding down or ending...its like they are trying to clean their souls of all the shit theyve seen and done to keep their careers afloat....its probably why a multi millionaire in the money earning prime of his career would publicly refer to himself as a SLAVE...it wasnt just creative control and tracklists that was bugging his soul...had to be more...and deeper...

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Reply #3 posted 08/22/18 2:53pm

PeteSilas

RJOrion said:

i believe he did...i believe many of the "superstar" entertainers do make some type of deal, whether with seen or unseen forces, there are too many stories throughout history, from the mouths of many insiders to deny that there is some truths to the notion that the entertainment industry is run by "people" who use the dark arts and the supernatural to make deals with, and control some of their artists... more than one person who was close to Prince throughout his life has made references to this...whether it was Morris Day's mother saying P was evil...even his sister calling him "The Prince Of Darkness"...Owen Husney implying he must have made some type of deal with the devil... to his cousins and aunties scaring him with Ouija boards when he was little... there is a reason why alot of these successful entertainers turn to religious fanaticism when their careers are winding down or ending...its like they are trying to clean their souls of all the shit theyve seen and done to keep their careers afloat....its probably why a multi millionaire in the money earning prime of his career would publicly refer to himself as a SLAVE...it wasnt just creative control and tracklists that was bugging his soul...had to be more...and deeper...

jimi hendrix supposedly thought he was possessed, probably where the inspiration for voodoo chile came from but he spoke about it with people close to him. dylan said he made a deal on the 60 minutes interview but wouldn't specify if it was jehovah or the devil. where did you read of oija boards and prince? never heard that one.

Prince.org: With fans like these he didn't need haters.
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Reply #4 posted 08/22/18 3:33pm

Francis77

RJOrion said:

i believe he did...i believe many of the "superstar" entertainers do make some type of deal, whether with seen or unseen forces, there are too many stories throughout history, from the mouths of many insiders to deny that there is some truths to the notion that the entertainment industry is run by "people" who use the dark arts and the supernatural to make deals with, and control some of their artists... more than one person who was close to Prince throughout his life has made references to this...whether it was Morris Day's mother saying P was evil...even his sister calling him "The Prince Of Darkness"...Owen Husney implying he must have made some type of deal with the devil... to his cousins and aunties scaring him with Ouija boards when he was little... there is a reason why alot of these successful entertainers turn to religious fanaticism when their careers are winding down or ending...its like they are trying to clean their souls of all the shit theyve seen and done to keep their careers afloat....its probably why a multi millionaire in the money earning prime of his career would publicly refer to himself as a SLAVE...it wasnt just creative control and tracklists that was bugging his soul...had to be more...and deeper...

I've always wondered if maybe why the intense religious conversion of Prince to the JW was because maybe he'd seen some of these things in the industry. There are so many stories of awful, dark things that are almost too much to believe. But there are too many stories to ignore that it may be true and they put it right in our face. I've always thought maybe Prince saw some things that very much bothered him and that was why he became so religious and so strict about it.

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Reply #5 posted 08/22/18 3:47pm

PeteSilas

Francis77 said:

RJOrion said:

i believe he did...i believe many of the "superstar" entertainers do make some type of deal, whether with seen or unseen forces, there are too many stories throughout history, from the mouths of many insiders to deny that there is some truths to the notion that the entertainment industry is run by "people" who use the dark arts and the supernatural to make deals with, and control some of their artists... more than one person who was close to Prince throughout his life has made references to this...whether it was Morris Day's mother saying P was evil...even his sister calling him "The Prince Of Darkness"...Owen Husney implying he must have made some type of deal with the devil... to his cousins and aunties scaring him with Ouija boards when he was little... there is a reason why alot of these successful entertainers turn to religious fanaticism when their careers are winding down or ending...its like they are trying to clean their souls of all the shit theyve seen and done to keep their careers afloat....its probably why a multi millionaire in the money earning prime of his career would publicly refer to himself as a SLAVE...it wasnt just creative control and tracklists that was bugging his soul...had to be more...and deeper...

I've always wondered if maybe why the intense religious conversion of Prince to the JW was because maybe he'd seen some of these things in the industry. There are so many stories of awful, dark things that are almost too much to believe. But there are too many stories to ignore that it may be true and they put it right in our face. I've always thought maybe Prince saw some things that very much bothered him and that was why he became so religious and so strict about it.

years ago, maybe 10, we were speaking of vanity on here, and, to a certain extent, Prince. we said the same thing, how the major religious awakenings happen to people who've done the worst shit, i'm sure it's true, i grew up in church and had to listen to a million "how bad i was before jesus" stories. I think maybe the headgames of the business might have something to do with it too, to us, they look successful but a lot of psychological bs goes on with a star of that magnitude to keep him in check. Billy Corgan accurately says it's like a pimp/ho, where the company tries to convince you that you ain't shit, they did it with Prince and he actually was treated very well by WB. they say Jimi was depressed over business and that may have been a reason he committed suicide, most people think jimi's death wasn't intentional but the despondency/depression over losing your artistic control is common. I just have to wonder how these guys would deal with the apathy most of us musicians have to live with, many talented people out here and will never get a break, just the realities of the biz.

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Reply #6 posted 08/22/18 3:58pm

CatB



He had powers and they must've come from somewhere. Just like his crying out for God and needing to do penance whenever the "evil twin" had gained the upper hand again.



"Time is space spent with U"
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Reply #7 posted 08/22/18 3:59pm

alandail

Prince’s whole career he sang about Love, Sex and God. What kind of “deal with the devil” would involve constantly singing about God?

His Jahova’s Witness conversion wasn’t about suddenly finding God or a response to things he saw in the industry. it was about dealing with the trauma of losing his child.

Why not just believe he was just naturally incredibly talented.
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Reply #8 posted 08/22/18 4:01pm

Strawberrylova
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CatB said:



He had powers and they must've come from somewhere. Just like his crying out for God and needing to do penance whenever the "evil twin" had gained the upper hand again.




Powers?? Elaborate please
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Reply #9 posted 08/22/18 4:10pm

OperatingTheta
n

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The recent Catholic Church abuse scandal in Pennsylvania involved 300 priests and over 1,000 children.

Yet people here still look to stereotypically 'dark' forces such as Satanism and 'pacts with the Devil'.
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Reply #10 posted 08/22/18 4:10pm

RJOrion

PeteSilas said:

RJOrion said:

i believe he did...i believe many of the "superstar" entertainers do make some type of deal, whether with seen or unseen forces, there are too many stories throughout history, from the mouths of many insiders to deny that there is some truths to the notion that the entertainment industry is run by "people" who use the dark arts and the supernatural to make deals with, and control some of their artists... more than one person who was close to Prince throughout his life has made references to this...whether it was Morris Day's mother saying P was evil...even his sister calling him "The Prince Of Darkness"...Owen Husney implying he must have made some type of deal with the devil... to his cousins and aunties scaring him with Ouija boards when he was little... there is a reason why alot of these successful entertainers turn to religious fanaticism when their careers are winding down or ending...its like they are trying to clean their souls of all the shit theyve seen and done to keep their careers afloat....its probably why a multi millionaire in the money earning prime of his career would publicly refer to himself as a SLAVE...it wasnt just creative control and tracklists that was bugging his soul...had to be more...and deeper...

jimi hendrix supposedly thought he was possessed, probably where the inspiration for voodoo chile came from but he spoke about it with people close to him. dylan said he made a deal on the 60 minutes interview but wouldn't specify if it was jehovah or the devil. where did you read of oija boards and prince? never heard that one.

Ouija board stories came directly from one of Prince's female cousins... 2 of his female cousins to be exact....

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Reply #11 posted 08/22/18 4:13pm

onlyforaminute

alandail said:

Prince’s whole career he sang about Love, Sex and God. What kind of “deal with the devil” would involve constantly singing about God? His Jahova’s Witness conversion wasn’t about suddenly finding God or a response to things he saw in the industry. it was about dealing with the trauma of losing his child. Why not just believe he was just naturally incredibly talented.



Too easy.

Year of Return 2019
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Reply #12 posted 08/22/18 4:14pm

PeteSilas

people in the early days used to say his use of god talk was just to hide the fact that he worshipped the devil, or rather that his god was the devil. threads on here about darling nikki being an ode to his selling of his soul are pretty compelling. If he did sell his soul, i don't think it's something you can reverse. Mostly, i think it's just a cool thing for musicians to say, Springsteen says' he sold his soul on one of his songs but it's most likely just a posture. It is interesting though that of the two major american figures in american folk music, both bob dylan and robert johnson both went away for a couple months and came back dramatically improved in their skills, who knows. I do believe in the spirit world, i might disagree with the names a bit but i do believe there are good and evil spirits all around us.

Prince.org: With fans like these he didn't need haters.
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Reply #13 posted 08/22/18 4:18pm

PeteSilas

RJOrion said:

PeteSilas said:

jimi hendrix supposedly thought he was possessed, probably where the inspiration for voodoo chile came from but he spoke about it with people close to him. dylan said he made a deal on the 60 minutes interview but wouldn't specify if it was jehovah or the devil. where did you read of oija boards and prince? never heard that one.

Ouija board stories came directly from one of Prince's female cousins... 2 of his female cousins to be exact....

where can i find them? online? in a book?

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Reply #14 posted 08/22/18 4:18pm

2045RadicalMat
tZ

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PeteSilas said:

RJOrion said:

i believe he did...i believe many of the "superstar" entertainers do make some type of deal, whether with seen or unseen forces, there are too many stories throughout history, from the mouths of many insiders to deny that there is some truths to the notion that the entertainment industry is run by "people" who use the dark arts and the supernatural to make deals with, and control some of their artists... more than one person who was close to Prince throughout his life has made references to this...whether it was Morris Day's mother saying P was evil...even his sister calling him "The Prince Of Darkness"...Owen Husney implying he must have made some type of deal with the devil... to his cousins and aunties scaring him with Ouija boards when he was little... there is a reason why alot of these successful entertainers turn to religious fanaticism when their careers are winding down or ending...its like they are trying to clean their souls of all the shit theyve seen and done to keep their careers afloat....its probably why a multi millionaire in the money earning prime of his career would publicly refer to himself as a SLAVE...it wasnt just creative control and tracklists that was bugging his soul...had to be more...and deeper...

jimi hendrix supposedly thought he was possessed, probably where the inspiration for voodoo chile came from but he spoke about it with people close to him. dylan said he made a deal on the 60 minutes interview but wouldn't specify if it was jehovah or the devil. where did you read of oija boards and prince? never heard that one.

Funny... not to derail this about PRINCE... but Eurythmics Star Dave Stewart said in an interview (with serious tone of voice) that he'd been "possessed" or "cut in" by another spirit when he'd had a near death experience in a vehicle crash.

It was a recent-ish conversation on a TV show and can be found by searching "Dave Stewart admits" - just those three words.

As for Prince. I don't know any of that. But I DO know that he was quite influential, and both sides "devil" and "God" were not far apart in his music or songs. I don't know anyone inside to tell what was an act, or hyperbole.


♫"Trollin, Trolling! We could have fun just trollin'!"♫
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Reply #15 posted 08/22/18 4:24pm

PeteSilas

2045RadicalMattZ said:

PeteSilas said:

jimi hendrix supposedly thought he was possessed, probably where the inspiration for voodoo chile came from but he spoke about it with people close to him. dylan said he made a deal on the 60 minutes interview but wouldn't specify if it was jehovah or the devil. where did you read of oija boards and prince? never heard that one.

Funny... not to derail this about PRINCE... but Eurythmics Star Dave Stewart said in an interview (with serious tone of voice) that he'd been "possessed" or "cut in" by another spirit when he'd had a near death experience in a vehicle crash.

It was a recent-ish conversation on a TV show and can be found by searching "Dave Stewart admits" - just those three words.

As for Prince. I don't know any of that. But I DO know that he was quite influential, and both sides "devil" and "God" were not far apart in his music or songs. I don't know anyone inside to tell what was an act, or hyperbole.


i'll check it out, i've seen demon possession or something like it when i lived with a preacher, it may not have been possession, i don't really know but it was wierd. just sar it, interesting. I knew a lady who fell out a window at 12 and came out of it with artistic talent she didn't have before. stewart says he became a genius after that.

[Edited 8/22/18 16:28pm]

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Reply #16 posted 08/22/18 4:40pm

alandail

PeteSilas said:

people in the early days used to say his use of god talk was just to hide the fact that he worshipped the devil, or rather that his god was the devil. threads on here about darling nikki being an ode to his selling of his soul are pretty compelling. If he did sell his soul, i don't think it's something you can reverse. Mostly, i think it's just a cool thing for musicians to say, Springsteen says' he sold his soul on one of his songs but it's most likely just a posture. It is interesting though that of the two major american figures in american folk music, both bob dylan and robert johnson both went away for a couple months and came back dramatically improved in their skills, who knows. I do believe in the spirit world, i might disagree with the names a bit but i do believe there are good and evil spirits all around us.

people though the backwards part at the end of Darling Nikki was satan worship. Those people clearly didn't bother to listen to it backwards because it says

"Hello, how r U? I'm fine 'cause I know that the Lord is coming soon. Coming, coming soon."

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Reply #17 posted 08/22/18 4:44pm

RJOrion

PeteSilas said:



RJOrion said:




PeteSilas said:



jimi hendrix supposedly thought he was possessed, probably where the inspiration for voodoo chile came from but he spoke about it with people close to him. dylan said he made a deal on the 60 minutes interview but wouldn't specify if it was jehovah or the devil. where did you read of oija boards and prince? never heard that one.






Ouija board stories came directly from one of Prince's female cousins... 2 of his female cousins to be exact....



where can i find them? online? in a book?



not online or a book...direct from the sources
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Reply #18 posted 08/22/18 4:46pm

PeteSilas

RJOrion said:

PeteSilas said:

where can i find them? online? in a book?

not online or a book...direct from the sources

what/'who recorded the stories? you? someone else?

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Reply #19 posted 08/22/18 4:47pm

dbpdexter

This is what the org has come to? disbelief Please out of respect for this mans legacy lockdance

AKA PDEXTER
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Reply #20 posted 08/22/18 4:47pm

PeteSilas

alandail said:

PeteSilas said:

people in the early days used to say his use of god talk was just to hide the fact that he worshipped the devil, or rather that his god was the devil. threads on here about darling nikki being an ode to his selling of his soul are pretty compelling. If he did sell his soul, i don't think it's something you can reverse. Mostly, i think it's just a cool thing for musicians to say, Springsteen says' he sold his soul on one of his songs but it's most likely just a posture. It is interesting though that of the two major american figures in american folk music, both bob dylan and robert johnson both went away for a couple months and came back dramatically improved in their skills, who knows. I do believe in the spirit world, i might disagree with the names a bit but i do believe there are good and evil spirits all around us.

people though the backwards part at the end of Darling Nikki was satan worship. Those people clearly didn't bother to listen to it backwards because it says

"Hello, how r U? I'm fine 'cause I know that the Lord is coming soon. Coming, coming soon."

ya, but as i pointed out, someones' "lord" could be anything or anyone, could have been jesus or the devil. gotta admit, some of his shit was pretty scary to a teenage me in those days, if it was holy it sounded unholy so it was perplexing to me.

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Reply #21 posted 08/22/18 4:50pm

PeteSilas

dbpdexter said:

This is what the org has come to? disbelief Please out of respect for this mans legacy lockdance

sorry but he created that kind of conjecture intentionally.

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Reply #22 posted 08/22/18 4:55pm

PeteSilas

onlyforaminute said:

alandail said:

Prince’s whole career he sang about Love, Sex and God. What kind of “deal with the devil” would involve constantly singing about God? His Jahova’s Witness conversion wasn’t about suddenly finding God or a response to things he saw in the industry. it was about dealing with the trauma of losing his child. Why not just believe he was just naturally incredibly talented.



Too easy.

or as greil marcus said about a contemporary of robert johnson's "sour grapes" but there is existing video from the 70's or so where old bluesmen who knew johnson say it was true.

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Reply #23 posted 08/22/18 4:56pm

Strawberrylova
123

lockdance lockdance lockdance yeah this thread is a bit disrespectful..sorry prince PRINCE4EVER
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Reply #24 posted 08/22/18 4:58pm

PeteSilas

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUK1P5x9Xak robert johsnon

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Reply #25 posted 08/22/18 4:59pm

RJOrion

PeteSilas said:



RJOrion said:


PeteSilas said:


where can i find them? online? in a book?



not online or a book...direct from the sources

what/'who recorded the stories? you? someone else?




no one recorded anything...
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Reply #26 posted 08/22/18 5:02pm

jjam

Pleeeeeease. Prince just happened to be hugely talented, very driven and a very hard worker.

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Reply #27 posted 08/22/18 5:04pm

alandail

PeteSilas said:

dbpdexter said:

This is what the org has come to? disbelief Please out of respect for this mans legacy lockdance

sorry but he created that kind of conjecture intentionally.

he invited some controversy, but his message always led to God

Let's go Crazy is about God

Purple Rain is about God

Lovesexy is about God

I went to teh Lovesexy concert, he had the entire arena singing "God is love, Love is God" over and over.

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Reply #28 posted 08/22/18 5:05pm

onlyforaminute

PeteSilas said:

onlyforaminute said:



Too easy.

or as greil marcus said about a contemporary of robert johnson's "sour grapes" but there is existing video from the 70's or so where old bluesmen who knew johnson say it was true.



Yes, because one person's experience fits all.

Year of Return 2019
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Reply #29 posted 08/22/18 5:09pm

PeteSilas

onlyforaminute said:

PeteSilas said:

or as greil marcus said about a contemporary of robert johnson's "sour grapes" but there is existing video from the 70's or so where old bluesmen who knew johnson say it was true.



Yes, because one person's experience fits all.

no, i'm saying people's motives could be all over the place, maybe they were just fucking jealous of Prince.

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