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Thread started 01/31/17 4:08am

purplerabbitho
le

"Good guy with a bad side or a bad guy with a good side?"

The question (in my subject heading) that toure asked Prince's supposed inner circle is one of the reasons toure bugs me. Do all of you remember that symposium on Prince (while he was still alive) when he talked about asking that question?

I get that Prince was a gemini who could be an taskmaster musician and divo (in other words, an asshole at least part of the time) but a "bad man" is a bit much.

Think about it--what kind of people do we think of as bad guys=-- dictators, mobsters, drug runners, rapists, pedophiles, white collar criminals, etc. In the entertainment industry there is plenty of backstabbing and pettiness (even amongst Prince's camp there was. People can't be serious when they act like Prince was the only one within his circle who could be petty and competitive sometimes. Look at the squabbling going on between Jesse Johnson and the Time right now. )

Toure asking that question of people in his former inner circle (some of which were disgruntled) was setting them up to refer to Prince in hyperbolic terms so of course a few of them are going to have to answer the later. It sounds like more of them answered the former but still.

Language and semantics do matter in public perception. Some of them probably should have just answered "I don't know."

Prince might have been an 'asshole with a good side' or a good guy with an asshole side but he wasn't the equivalent of a villian in a movie or even Bill Cosby or Frank Sinatra. He wasn't violent and his life didn't ruin other lives. No one ended up worse than they began even if working for him could be difficult and nerve racking.

I was just watching the Mariah Carey reality show. Lame kiss assing all the way through. But there was this member of her band or entourage who was giving the cold shoulder and fighting with another member because he wanted to have fun, smoke weed and cuss on the tour bus and she had brought her baby with her. Its a job dude, not a vacation...

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Reply #1 posted 01/31/17 4:21am

1Sasha

The one comment which has stuck with me since Prince passed was from Wendy. She said Prince "trained" The Revolution, and that when they were preparing the First Avenue shows, they were lost - the boss was not there. Somehow, an essentially abandoned 13-year-old child transformed himself within four years into an extraordinary leader with supreme confidence. He KNEW! He knew what he wanted to do. He knew what he wanted everyone around him to do. He knew what kind of life he wanted to have. He worked them hard so that they were always prepared. They have all said it was the best education they could have asked for. Prince said No Doubt was comprised of nice people but they could not improvise - they could perform songs by rote but that was it. Prince's bands were ready for anything because he trained them that way. In his personal life as well he seemed to be very "my way or the highway," until the past couple of years. Why the change? A lot have speculated, but no one has the answer. All I can say is there has never been anyone like him, and there never will be anyone like him. We were blessed to have lived when Prince lived.

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Reply #2 posted 01/31/17 4:56am

rogifan

1Sasha said:

The one comment which has stuck with me since Prince passed was from Wendy. She said Prince "trained" The Revolution, and that when they were preparing the First Avenue shows, they were lost - the boss was not there. Somehow, an essentially abandoned 13-year-old child transformed himself within four years into an extraordinary leader with supreme confidence. He KNEW! He knew what he wanted to do. He knew what he wanted everyone around him to do. He knew what kind of life he wanted to have. He worked them hard so that they were always prepared. They have all said it was the best education they could have asked for. Prince said No Doubt was comprised of nice people but they could not improvise - they could perform songs by rote but that was it. Prince's bands were ready for anything because he trained them that way. In his personal life as well he seemed to be very "my way or the highway," until the past couple of years. Why the change? A lot have speculated, but no one has the answer. All I can say is there has never been anyone like him, and there never will be anyone like him. We were blessed to have lived when Prince lived.


Something that Jimmy jam said has stuck with me too. He said (and I'm paraphrasing) that Prince was the most talented person in the room yet was also the hardest worker. It's easier to work hard for a boss who you know is working just as hard as you if not harder. And you probably also have more respect for someone who is extremely talented in their field yet still works so hard to make themselves even better at what they do.
Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜
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Reply #3 posted 01/31/17 10:20am

LovePaisley

purplerabbithole said:

The question (in my subject heading) that toure asked Prince's supposed inner circle is one of the reasons toure bugs me. Do all of you remember that symposium on Prince (while he was still alive) when he talked about asking that question?

I have a mixed opinion about Toure in general. In that same group interview, Alan Leeds at one point looks at both Toure and QuestLove like they have three heads and says in disbelief something like, "You guys think you really knew him?" Alan Leeds may have his own agenda--definite love/hate thing going on there--but he certainly did know Prince.

Toure's book is also a bit weak, in my opinion. (Disclaimer: for whatever that's worth. It's just my opinion as a reader.) It covers the same old ground and appears to quote old interviews. Or maybe his interviews covered the usual questions. Hard to know. The Gen X theme running through the book felt like padding to make the book longer.

So based on that--I do get to the point eventually--I haven't seen that Toure had any real insight to Prince in the first place.

confused

And the MUSIC continues...forever...
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Reply #4 posted 01/31/17 11:59am

Wlcm2thdwn3

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" I GOT 2 SIDES, AND THEY BOTH FRIENDS "---My name is Prince. smile

A whole lot better off than the fools he left here.
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Reply #5 posted 01/31/17 12:08pm

databank

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A COMPREHENSIVE PRINCE DISCOGRAPHY (work in progress ^^): https://sites.google.com/...iscog/home
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Reply #6 posted 01/31/17 12:47pm

MD431Madcat

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my answer is...

Mega insecure..F***** up in the head ..self centered..hard working..

music meastro

that couldn't be trusted by many people - including wives, girlfriends, band members & fans.

But with enough-

money,

oppoutunities and specialness

to keep everyone coming back for more abuse. wink

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Reply #7 posted 02/01/17 11:23pm

sonshine

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He was so ahead of everyone else they had to work extremely hard to be a part of his gig. As tight as his bands were he must have rehearsed them to the bone. But I've never heard anyone who worked with him musically who hasn't said they grew a lot professionally ftom their time with him. I think he was difficult. No doubt about that. But I don't think he was "bad" per se. He was very proud of his musicians. But yes, he could make it very awkward and uncomfor table. I've read countless accounts of people who worked for him or for PP who had been let go for minor issues. He was very unapproachable is the sense I get about him. But he didn't ask anymore from his people than he was willing to give himself.
It's a hurtful place, the world, in and of itself. We don't need to add to it. We all need one another. ~ PRN
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Reply #8 posted 02/02/17 4:52am

ACharmed1

Why can't he be an extremely gifted good man that has the same flaws as the rest of the world? Just cuz he was famous he (like every other famous person) gets put under a microscope. P NEVER said he was pefect. In fact he always said the opposite.

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Reply #9 posted 02/02/17 6:07am

rogifan

ACharmed1 said:

Why can't he be an extremely gifted good man that has the same flaws as the rest of the world? Just cuz he was famous he (like every other famous person) gets put under a microscope. P NEVER said he was pefect. In fact he always said the opposite.


yeahthat
Paisley Park is in your heart
#PrinceForever 💜
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Reply #10 posted 02/03/17 7:22am

PeteSilas

anyone with that much scrutiny on them is going to have their faults magnified just as well as their virtues. sinatra, MJ, Elvis all did plenty of bad things. Most people have skeletons in their closets, regrets, things they've done that were abhorrent but no one ever hears about it. Not to make excuses for Prince, i just don't see human beings in the idealistic way I did when i was young.

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Reply #11 posted 02/03/17 7:29am

purplepoppy

Wlcm2thdwn3 said:

" I GOT 2 SIDES, AND THEY BOTH FRIENDS "---My name is Prince. smile

heart this !

-

We could ask the same stupid question about Toure but nobody cares. Guy makes a living off Prince, that's enough.

Brand new boogie without the hero.
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Reply #12 posted 02/03/17 7:30am

PeteSilas

sonshine said:

He was so ahead of everyone else they had to work extremely hard to be a part of his gig. As tight as his bands were he must have rehearsed them to the bone. But I've never heard anyone who worked with him musically who hasn't said they grew a lot professionally ftom their time with him. I think he was difficult. No doubt about that. But I don't think he was "bad" per se. He was very proud of his musicians. But yes, he could make it very awkward and uncomfor table. I've read countless accounts of people who worked for him or for PP who had been let go for minor issues. He was very unapproachable is the sense I get about him. But he didn't ask anymore from his people than he was willing to give himself.

you pretty much have to be demanding with people, especially musicians, you leave it up to them they'll smoke pot all day and yak. I don't work with other musicians because I want things my way but I don't want to cajole or berate anyone. In Springsteens new book he sheds some light on the headaches he had with bands in his early days and later with the e. street band. He broke them up in the early 90's because he was tired of dealing with it. Of course, one thing that's common for he and Prince, musicians are never happy with how much they get paid. Bruce didn't name the member who asked for a raise and Bruce told him he'd match whatever the musician who was getting paid more for the same job got. then he said that he'd save him the time and to look in the mirror. I've heard varying stories about Prince and how he paid others for all that hard work. Alan Leeds said he was "very generous" at the end of the Purple Rain zeitgeist but lots of people have complained about pay. and we'eve allheard the stories through the years about how he wouldn't pay bills. I honestly don't think all of that was out of maliciousness, I just think that he, like i, just really don't care that much for finance and consider dealing with it a big waste of time. No excuse, no, but I believe that's part of it, I don't think he was always trying to be a meanie. Some stories are just too cold though.

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Reply #13 posted 02/03/17 9:42am

justAmeda

purplerabbithole said:

The question (in my subject heading) that toure asked Prince's supposed inner circle is one of the reasons toure bugs me. Do all of you remember that symposium on Prince (while he was still alive) when he talked about asking that question?

I get that Prince was a gemini who could be an taskmaster musician and divo (in other words, an asshole at least part of the time) but a "bad man" is a bit much.

Think about it--what kind of people do we think of as bad guys=-- dictators, mobsters, drug runners, rapists, pedophiles, white collar criminals, etc. In the entertainment industry there is plenty of backstabbing and pettiness (even amongst Prince's camp there was. People can't be serious when they act like Prince was the only one within his circle who could be petty and competitive sometimes. Look at the squabbling going on between Jesse Johnson and the Time right now. )

Toure asking that question of people in his former inner circle (some of which were disgruntled) was setting them up to refer to Prince in hyperbolic terms so of course a few of them are going to have to answer the later. It sounds like more of them answered the former but still.

Language and semantics do matter in public perception. Some of them probably should have just answered "I don't know."

Prince might have been an 'asshole with a good side' or a good guy with an asshole side but he wasn't the equivalent of a villian in a movie or even Bill Cosby or Frank Sinatra. He wasn't violent and his life didn't ruin other lives. No one ended up worse than they began even if working for him could be difficult and nerve racking.

I was just watching the Mariah Carey reality show. Lame kiss assing all the way through. But there was this member of her band or entourage who was giving the cold shoulder and fighting with another member because he wanted to have fun, smoke weed and cuss on the tour bus and she had brought her baby with her. Its a job dude, not a vacation...

hmph! without Jesse there ain't no Time! biggrin

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Reply #14 posted 02/03/17 5:28pm

PeteSilas

so jesse is fighting with the time right now? do tell, I hadn't heard. and ya, band squabbles are nothing new, it's tough to get young men together in one spot and not expect trouble. there is always trouble, always. Some of it stuff that can be forgotten. I've even read about Elvis' first trio get on each others nerves on the long rides, get out of the car for a fight with the guitarist saying "would somebody hurry up and punch somebody so we can get to the gig". John and Paul has a rivalry which Paul still carries on to this day (if you listen for it).

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Reply #15 posted 02/07/17 1:15am

etherwoman

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We all possess angelic and demonic qualities. Prince's genius was in part due to his high level of spirituality, and his awareness of how much love and how much evil and fear exists in humanity, in himself. It was his command in finding the words to define the extremes of each, interpreting them into music, and calling on us to remember those places in our own hearts and souls, that resonate with people.

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Reply #16 posted 02/07/17 2:09am

CatB


He was neither good nor bad, he was human. He had flaws, he had dark, he could be cruel and mean. He was sweet, he could be a baby, he made you want to be your best, he was love.
He knew what he wanted and he didn't compromise. To less spiritually advanced people this can be a threat. He was a force and his dualistic character part of his success. It was fascinating. I don't recall one boring moment.

"Time is space spent with U"
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Reply #17 posted 02/07/17 2:34am

Lovejunky

CatB said:


He was neither good nor bad, he was human. He had flaws, he had dark, he could be cruel and mean. He was sweet, he could be a baby, he made you want to be your best, he was love.
He knew what he wanted and he didn't compromise. To less spiritually advanced people this can be a threat. He was a force and his dualistic character part of his success. It was fascinating. I don't recall one boring moment.

You GOT him

Lucky Cat...if only for a few moments in time ,you got to lick the cream...you understood him as well as one could....

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