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Reply #210 posted 06/02/16 3:24pm

nursev

CROWNS1 said:



nursev said:


cindyt said:


how do you think he got it? anybody? he should have been committed to a psychiatric hospital...I am right about that nursev right...or an addiction center...shouldn't have been a choice...right? he was way too far gone for him to be running around alone with narcotics? also, you all realize the effects on breathing, heart from this stuff?



I work in detox and if Prince was in the state I think he was in he should've been in an acute care facility...a damn hospital!


This. As well as having a child addicted to opiods, I also work in the MH/Substance abuse field. Fentanyl is more powerful than heroin...there is no way he could have come off of them by himself. I'm leaning towards believing that Dr. Schulenberg didn't prescribe it, but I believe his part in this and perhaps what could get him in trouble is that he attempted to help Prince wean off of opiods outside of a detox facility, which was a recipe for disaster. Being off of the meds for days and then taking it can cause an overdose and this doctor should not have been a part of a do it yourself detox. My opinion only.



I agree...anytime a person is detoxing from anything there is always a potential to have a medical emergency this is why you have nurses and doctors at substance abuse facilities. Prince needed to be in a hospital.
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Reply #211 posted 06/02/16 3:25pm

alphastreet

purplethunder3121 said:



alphastreet said:


Oh no sad that's awful. I totally understand why it happened, I know people with the patches too for their chronic pain, and one patch can not be good enough too and countering it or wanting to can be risky. I don't know about the US but over here there have been concerns about patches being available on the black market and what could be done to regulate use or how to distribute them in general. I don't know if Prince may have tried to double them for a short time and it killed him or what but something like that is so sad and so preventable if you have proper support and coping strategies in place

Hell, doctors even warn people taking nicotine patches not to over do them and certainly not to take them while they smoke cigs at the same time--they risk having a heart attack!



Ingesting the content on the patch when changing them is also high risk, as someone said one must wear gloves and discard of them safely. I really feel sad about this cause he deserved better, he's being labeled unfairly for something not his fault, and it's too close to home cause a close friend of mine with chronic pain who used Fentanyl and struggled in the beginning :*(

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Reply #212 posted 06/02/16 3:25pm

nursev

and what self respecting doctor would advise a client to detox at home...lemme make a housecall...the hell?
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Reply #213 posted 06/02/16 3:26pm

jesme1999

mont0372 said:



jesme1999 said:


simm0061 said:

My sister works in a MN hospital and says she's never seen that prescribed. It is usually administered at the hospital, usually when someone is terminal. She said it is used for "conscious sedation" in hospitals. And a pain specialist would only prescribe that if the paitent was terminal...and even then, not likely.


Some one is probably going to go to jail on this one. Probably why that MN Dr was fired...



I know many people who go to pain management And are prescribes Fentanyl patches plus Pills My 83 yr old ex mother in law is one of them . Its used alot for severe chronic pain .

From my understanding, Prince didn't have a Fentanyl patch, he injected it. I don't think it's normal for a patient to inject. Correct me if I'm wrong.





Oh damn ! I missed that part , i knew
That some inject it but didnt want to
Go there so just stuck with ate
You use to be able to chew them up according
To my addict perso who takes them
But they changed something and now you
Have to cut them open and eat the gel
Smh
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Reply #214 posted 06/02/16 3:27pm

BanishedBrian

RiotPaisley said:

BanishedBrian said:


If he had cancer, I'd think that his family and friends would have disclosed it weeks ago, as it would have been a sympathetic story that would have squashed most of the speculation about drug dependence/addiction.

Maybe they didn't know- they have the full report and it's their info to distribute if they desire. I could see him not telling his blood family. Close friends may have known. But he didn't want us to know so... I don't expect to hear about it.


If he had cancer, we'll hear about it immently... there is no way that the family would allow the publicly released cause to be opioid OD when the underlying cause was cancer. Further, in those circumstances I think the medical examiner would have included cancer as a "cause of cause" on the report.

No Candy 4 Me
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Reply #215 posted 06/02/16 3:27pm

PeteSilas

jonnylawson said:

i have never read such misinformed and wholly disrespectful bullshit

i work in ICU and on the rescue chopper /air ambulace

i give fentanyl daily , i understand its actions and how/who gets it ,Part of my masters was on anelgesia and its compund effects.

as you get older you realise if you dont know what you are talking about..why not simply say nothing?

A thread discussing an autopsy on somebody you didnt know is fucking abhorent in my book

most of you on this thread have reinforced my viewpoint on this site

RIP prince-you deserved way more respect than has been given here

i know, we are just awful, the door is over that way

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Reply #216 posted 06/02/16 3:28pm

nursev

jonnylawson said:

i have never read such misinformed and wholly disrespectful bullshit



i work in ICU and on the rescue chopper /air ambulace



i give fentanyl daily , i understand its actions and how/who gets it ,Part of my masters was on anelgesia and its compund effects.


as you get older you realise if you dont know what you are talking about..why not simply say nothing?



A thread discussing an autopsy on somebody you didnt know is fucking abhorent in my book




most of you on this thread have reinforced my viewpoint on this site





RIP prince-you deserved way more respect than has been given here







so since you've injected it enlighten those of us who haven't
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Reply #217 posted 06/02/16 3:28pm

nursev

PeteSilas said:



jonnylawson said:


i have never read such misinformed and wholly disrespectful bullshit



i work in ICU and on the rescue chopper /air ambulace



i give fentanyl daily , i understand its actions and how/who gets it ,Part of my masters was on anelgesia and its compund effects.


as you get older you realise if you dont know what you are talking about..why not simply say nothing?



A thread discussing an autopsy on somebody you didnt know is fucking abhorent in my book




most of you on this thread have reinforced my viewpoint on this site





RIP prince-you deserved way more respect than has been given here







i know, we are just awful, the door is over that way



exactly
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Reply #218 posted 06/02/16 3:28pm

CROWNS1

nursev said:

and what self respecting doctor would advise a client to detox at home...lemme make a housecall...the hell?

I think this may turn out to be the cause of his unemployment. I would be willing to bet he tried to get Prince to go into detox, unsuccessfully, but at that time he should have stepped back. Who knows, maybe he was sincerely trying to help, but as a doctor he HAD to know the futility of what he was attempting to do.

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Reply #219 posted 06/02/16 3:30pm

Figure5

jonnylawson said:

i have never read such misinformed and wholly disrespectful bullshit

i work in ICU and on the rescue chopper /air ambulace

i give fentanyl daily , i understand its actions and how/who gets it ,Part of my masters was on anelgesia and its compund effects.

as you get older you realise if you dont know what you are talking about..why not simply say nothing?

A thread discussing an autopsy on somebody you didnt know is fucking abhorent in my book

most of you on this thread have reinforced my viewpoint on this site

RIP prince-you deserved way more respect than has been given here

I agree with you.

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Reply #220 posted 06/02/16 3:30pm

jesme1999

mont0372 said:



jesme1999 said:


simm0061 said:

My sister works in a MN hospital and says she's never seen that prescribed. It is usually administered at the hospital, usually when someone is terminal. She said it is used for "conscious sedation" in hospitals. And a pain specialist would only prescribe that if the paitent was terminal...and even then, not likely.


Some one is probably going to go to jail on this one. Probably why that MN Dr was fired...



I know many people who go to pain management And are prescribes Fentanyl patches plus Pills My 83 yr old ex mother in law is one of them . Its used alot for severe chronic pain .

From my understanding, Prince didn't have a Fentanyl patch, he injected it. I don't think it's normal for a patient to inject. Correct me if I'm wrong.





Ive never heard of it in any form other
Than a patch , not saying there isnt
Another form .
But yeah they cut them open and inject
Or eat the gel ... And no its not normal .
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Reply #221 posted 06/02/16 3:31pm

BanishedBrian

CROWNS1 said:

nursev said:

and what self respecting doctor would advise a client to detox at home...lemme make a housecall...the hell?

I think this may turn out to be the cause of his unemployment. I would be willing to bet he tried to get Prince to go into detox, unsuccessfully, but at that time he should have stepped back. Who knows, maybe he was sincerely trying to help, but as a doctor he HAD to know the futility of what he was attempting to do.


What do you mean by stepped back?

No Candy 4 Me
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Reply #222 posted 06/02/16 3:31pm

babynoz

CROWNS1 said:

nursev said:

cindyt said: I work in detox and if Prince was in the state I think he was in he should've been in an acute care facility...a damn hospital!

This. As well as having a child addicted to opiates, I also work in the MH/Substance abuse field. Fentanyl is more powerful than heroin...there is no way he could have come off of them by himself. I'm leaning towards believing that Dr. Schulenberg didn't prescribe it, but I believe his part in this and perhaps what could get him in trouble is that he attempted to help Prince wean off of opiates outside of a detox facility, which was a recipe for disaster. Being off of the meds for days and then taking it can cause an overdose and this doctor should not have been a part of a do it yourself detox. My opinion only.

[Edited 6/2/16 15:24pm]

[Edited 6/2/16 15:24pm]

[Edited 6/2/16 15:25pm]



That seems to me why it was ruled accidental.

Prince, in you I found a kindred spirit...Rest In Paradise.
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Reply #223 posted 06/02/16 3:32pm

Dibblekins

BanishedBrian said:

RiotPaisley said:

BanishedBrian said: Maybe they didn't know- they have the full report and it's their info to distribute if they desire. I could see him not telling his blood family. Close friends may have known. But he didn't want us to know so... I don't expect to hear about it.


If he had cancer, we'll hear about it immently... there is no way that the family would allow the publicly released cause to be opioid OD when the underlying cause was cancer. Further, in those circumstances I think the medical examiner would have included cancer as a "cause of cause" on the report.

No, that's not the case. Underlying diseases / conditions don't have to be included if they're not the PRECISE cause of death.

As I explained earlier, my Dad had bladder cancer which caused renal blockage / failure - and it was the latter that led directly to his death. On the resultant certificate, the cause of death cited was 'renal failure', not the underlying disease (bladder cancer).

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Reply #224 posted 06/02/16 3:33pm

nursev

see this why we can never have decent conversations here about anything...always somebody trying to negate the experience of others. We're just discussing it...if you have a legitimate answer then help us understand.
[Edited 6/2/16 15:37pm]
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Reply #225 posted 06/02/16 3:38pm

babynoz

jonnylawson said:

i have never read such misinformed and wholly disrespectful bullshit

i work in ICU and on the rescue chopper /air ambulace

i give fentanyl daily , i understand its actions and how/who gets it ,Part of my masters was on anelgesia and its compund effects.

as you get older you realise if you dont know what you are talking about..why not simply say nothing?

A thread discussing an autopsy on somebody you didnt know is fucking abhorent in my book

most of you on this thread have reinforced my viewpoint on this site

RIP prince-you deserved way more respect than has been given here



So for an entire six weeks you kept your mouth shut and had zero problems with rampant, baseless speculation but now that actual facts are being discussed it's suddenly unbearable to you? Alrighty then.....

I swear, some of y'all are soooo extra, confuse

Prince, in you I found a kindred spirit...Rest In Paradise.
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Reply #226 posted 06/02/16 3:38pm

purplethunder3
121

avatar

nursev said:

see this why we can never have decent conversations here about anything...always somebody trying to negate the experience of others. We're just discussing it...if you have a legitimate answer then help us understand. [Edited 6/2/16 15:37pm]

I think this conversation is important...for many reasons. And I am very glad that health care professionals are weighing in on it to educate those of us who know nothing about it.

"Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination and life to everything." --Plato
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Reply #227 posted 06/02/16 3:39pm

nursev

babynoz said:



jonnylawson said:


i have never read such misinformed and wholly disrespectful bullshit



i work in ICU and on the rescue chopper /air ambulace



i give fentanyl daily , i understand its actions and how/who gets it ,Part of my masters was on anelgesia and its compund effects.


as you get older you realise if you dont know what you are talking about..why not simply say nothing?



A thread discussing an autopsy on somebody you didnt know is fucking abhorent in my book




most of you on this thread have reinforced my viewpoint on this site





RIP prince-you deserved way more respect than has been given here









So for an entire six weeks you kept your mouth shut and had zero problems with rampant, baseless speculation but now that actual facts are being discussed it's suddenly unbearable to you? Alrighty then.....

I swear, some of y'all are soooo extra, confuse



agreed
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Reply #228 posted 06/02/16 3:40pm

babynoz

nursev said:

see this why we can never have decent conversations here about anything...always somebody trying to negate the experience of others. We're just discussing it...if you have a legitimate answer then help us understand. [Edited 6/2/16 15:37pm]



Not to mention he's about six weeks too late to start pissing and moaning now.

Prince, in you I found a kindred spirit...Rest In Paradise.
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Reply #229 posted 06/02/16 3:40pm

rainbowchild

avatar

nursev said:

CROWNS1 said:



nursev said:


cindyt said:


how do you think he got it? anybody? he should have been committed to a psychiatric hospital...I am right about that nursev right...or an addiction center...shouldn't have been a choice...right? he was way too far gone for him to be running around alone with narcotics? also, you all realize the effects on breathing, heart from this stuff?



I work in detox and if Prince was in the state I think he was in he should've been in an acute care facility...a damn hospital!


This. As well as having a child addicted to opiods, I also work in the MH/Substance abuse field. Fentanyl is more powerful than heroin...there is no way he could have come off of them by himself. I'm leaning towards believing that Dr. Schulenberg didn't prescribe it, but I believe his part in this and perhaps what could get him in trouble is that he attempted to help Prince wean off of opiods outside of a detox facility, which was a recipe for disaster. Being off of the meds for days and then taking it can cause an overdose and this doctor should not have been a part of a do it yourself detox. My opinion only.



I agree...anytime a person is detoxing from anything there is always a potential to have a medical emergency this is why you have nurses and doctors at substance abuse facilities. Prince needed to be in a hospital.



Indeed. He could have gotten help at Mayo Clinic-- one of the best hospitals in the U.S.-- right there in Minnesota.
"Just like the sun, the Rainbow Children rise."

"Am I black or white? Am I straight or gay?"

"We had fun, didn't we?"
-Prince (1958-2016) 4ever in my life
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Reply #230 posted 06/02/16 3:41pm

nursev

purplethunder3121 said:



nursev said:


see this why we can never have decent conversations here about anything...always somebody trying to negate the experience of others. We're just discussing it...if you have a legitimate answer then help us understand. [Edited 6/2/16 15:37pm]

I think this conversation is important...for many reasons. And I am very glad that health care professionals are weighing in on it to educate those of us who know nothing about it.



In no way has anyone here said anything to disrespect Prince...we all loved the man. I think people are just trynna make some sense of this tragedy.
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Reply #231 posted 06/02/16 3:41pm

nursev

babynoz said:



nursev said:


see this why we can never have decent conversations here about anything...always somebody trying to negate the experience of others. We're just discussing it...if you have a legitimate answer then help us understand. [Edited 6/2/16 15:37pm]



Not to mention he's about six weeks too late to start pissing and moaning now.



clapping
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Reply #232 posted 06/02/16 3:42pm

babynoz

purplethunder3121 said:

nursev said:

see this why we can never have decent conversations here about anything...always somebody trying to negate the experience of others. We're just discussing it...if you have a legitimate answer then help us understand. [Edited 6/2/16 15:37pm]

I think this conversation is important...for many reasons. And I am very glad that health care professionals are weighing in on it to educate those of us who know nothing about it.


It sure taught me to avoid fentanyl if at all possible, so I for one am grateful. eek

Prince, in you I found a kindred spirit...Rest In Paradise.
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Reply #233 posted 06/02/16 3:43pm

nursev

rainbowchild said:

nursev said:



I agree...anytime a person is detoxing from anything there is always a potential to have a medical emergency this is why you have nurses and doctors at substance abuse facilities. Prince needed to be in a hospital.



Indeed. He could have gotten help at Mayo Clinic-- one of the best hospitals in the U.S.-- right there in Minnesota.


that in itself is just truly sad.
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Reply #234 posted 06/02/16 3:45pm

Justgivemearos
e

He must have been in a lot of pain.This medication is not for a little pain. It is heavy heavy stuff.
I just wonder why he waited so long to get a proper treatment for his pains.
Why stay in pain ? Nobody should have to live in pain all the time. It is such a shame he died. We can never go to concerts again.
I wish we could go back in time ... and that someone oblidged him to stay in a hospital untill all the medical problems are solved.
Rest in piece Angel
Love
There's something else ...the afterworld ..lets go crazy
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Reply #235 posted 06/02/16 3:46pm

lavie

avatar

nursev said:

see this why we can never have decent conversations here about anything...always somebody trying to negate the experience of others. We're just discussing it...if you have a legitimate answer then help us understand. [Edited 6/2/16 15:37pm]

Very much appreciate your input on this discussion as a medical professional. Not sure why it would be disrespectful to Prince to have this discussion.

Have U had your + today?
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Reply #236 posted 06/02/16 3:51pm

alphastreet

lavie said:



nursev said:


see this why we can never have decent conversations here about anything...always somebody trying to negate the experience of others. We're just discussing it...if you have a legitimate answer then help us understand. [Edited 6/2/16 15:37pm]


Very much appreciate your input on this discussion as a medical professional. Not sure why it would be disrespectful to Prince to have this discussion.



Totally agree with you guys.
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Reply #237 posted 06/02/16 3:53pm

Dibblekins

Justgivemearose said:

He must have been in a lot of pain.This medication is not for a little pain. It is heavy heavy stuff. I just wonder why he waited so long to get a proper treatment for his pains. Why stay in pain ? Nobody should have to live in pain all the time. It is such a shame he died. We can never go to concerts again. I wish we could go back in time ... and that someone oblidged him to stay in a hospital untill all the medical problems are solved. Rest in piece Angel Love

Sadly, sometimes, there are no solutions to chronic pain conditions. Surgery isn't always the answer - and can, in more instances than I'd like to mention, actually exacerbate / cause more pain and a worsening of symptomatology.

Until we find out (IF we ever find out) the underlying cause for Prince's pain, we can't know if there were any alternatives to his taking strong medication.

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Reply #238 posted 06/02/16 3:53pm

nursev

lavie said:



nursev said:


see this why we can never have decent conversations here about anything...always somebody trying to negate the experience of others. We're just discussing it...if you have a legitimate answer then help us understand. [Edited 6/2/16 15:37pm]


Very much appreciate your input on this discussion as a medical professional. Not sure why it would be disrespectful to Prince to have this discussion.



no problem...but I'm done. These conversations here always end badly. Prince probably could've been saved if he had employees who knew what to do and were not just yes men... yes men kill.
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Reply #239 posted 06/02/16 3:55pm

CROWNS1

BanishedBrian said:

CROWNS1 said:

I think this may turn out to be the cause of his unemployment. I would be willing to bet he tried to get Prince to go into detox, unsuccessfully, but at that time he should have stepped back. Who knows, maybe he was sincerely trying to help, but as a doctor he HAD to know the futility of what he was attempting to do.


What do you mean by stepped back?

Told him that he could only treat him in a detox facility....referred him to an addiction specialist. Schulenberg is a family practioner/ob physician. Addiction recovery is not his specialty. There is NO WAY something like this can be done alone, at home.

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Forums > Prince: Music and More > Midwest Medical Examiner’s Office just released the investigation results...