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Reply #30 posted 11/13/19 11:04am

poppys

jaawwnn said:

poppys said:

You really don't get it. Bernie is not a Democrat, he is an Independent. BUT, he could be NOMINATED by the Dems and therefore have an actual chance at winning. Which is what he is trying to do. And if he gets the nomination, I will vote for him. I will vote for whoever gets the Dem nomination because that is the only candidate that can beat Republicans in 2020. Capiche?


Yes, that was my understanding of it 12 months ago until you started telling me it was impossible because of your very complicated primary system.


Yes I know that, I know how that system works, and I remember all the talk that they might defy the voters' wishes and refuse to elect Trump and it all came to nothing.


And I think Buttigieg would at least make a decent VP. That's my educated opinion.

I'd probably share that opinion shrug


Bullshit. I've known how the system works for years. I'm as old as Prince, dude.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #31 posted 11/13/19 11:28am

lazycrockett

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poppys said:

You really don't get it. Bernie is not a Democrat, he is an Independent. BUT, he could be NOMINATED by the Dems and therefore have an actual chance at winning. Which is what he is trying to do. And if he gets the nomination, I will vote for him. I will vote for whoever gets the Dem nomination because that is the only candidate that can beat Republicans in 2020. Capiche?

If you don't, review The Electoral College system, our President is not elected by the poplular vote or we wouldn't have Trump in the first place.

And I think Buttigieg would at least make a decent VP. That's my educated opinion.

If you want to win the EC you have to go through the midwest. Too far left and you've lost them. M4A will not play well with unions who have negotiated for healthcare over wage increase. Taking that away with a policy that that could be easily overturned by the next GOP controlled Government scares the shit out of people, rightfully so.

The Most Important Thing In Life Is Sincerity....Once You Can Fake That, You Can Fake Anything.
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Reply #32 posted 11/13/19 11:46am

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

lazycrockett said:

poppys said:

You really don't get it. Bernie is not a Democrat, he is an Independent. BUT, he could be NOMINATED by the Dems and therefore have an actual chance at winning. Which is what he is trying to do. And if he gets the nomination, I will vote for him. I will vote for whoever gets the Dem nomination because that is the only candidate that can beat Republicans in 2020. Capiche?

If you don't, review The Electoral College system, our President is not elected by the poplular vote or we wouldn't have Trump in the first place.

And I think Buttigieg would at least make a decent VP. That's my educated opinion.

If you want to win the EC you have to go through the midwest. Too far left and you've lost them. M4A will not play well with unions who have negotiated for healthcare over wage increase. Taking that away with a policy that that could be easily overturned by the next GOP controlled Government scares the shit out of people, rightfully so.


People forget how difficult the fight for Obamacare was, and how it's been under fire all this time ever since

.

It's one thing to want anything, but you also have to have a realistic plan on how to achieve it.
Buttigeig has acknowledged this with a roadmap towards expanding Obamacare without reinventing the wheel and throwing everything into disarray.

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Reply #33 posted 11/13/19 12:38pm

lazycrockett

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^We wouldnt have the ACA if it wasn't for one old white dude who found some compassion before he died.

We dont have republicans like that anymore.

The Most Important Thing In Life Is Sincerity....Once You Can Fake That, You Can Fake Anything.
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Reply #34 posted 11/13/19 1:16pm

poppys

lazycrockett said:

poppys said:

You really don't get it. Bernie is not a Democrat, he is an Independent. BUT, he could be NOMINATED by the Dems and therefore have an actual chance at winning. Which is what he is trying to do. And if he gets the nomination, I will vote for him. I will vote for whoever gets the Dem nomination because that is the only candidate that can beat Republicans in 2020. Capiche?

If you don't, review The Electoral College system, our President is not elected by the poplular vote or we wouldn't have Trump in the first place.

And I think Buttigieg would at least make a decent VP. That's my educated opinion.


If you want to win the EC you have to go through the midwest. Too far left and you've lost them. M4A will not play well with unions who have negotiated for healthcare over wage increase. Taking that away with a policy that that could be easily overturned by the next GOP controlled Government scares the shit out of people, rightfully so.

Good points.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #35 posted 11/13/19 1:40pm

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

2freaky4church1 said:

Votes don't matter.


neither do most of your posts... just sayin' wink





[Edited 11/13/19 13:40pm]

"Families are torn apart, men women and children are separated. Children come home from school to find their parents have gone missing." - Anne Frank
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Reply #36 posted 11/13/19 2:32pm

13cjk13

lazycrockett said:

Maybe before people start bashing Pete, they should take a look at his platform. His Douglass Plan is the most progressive on racial issues in decades.

https://peteforamerica.com/issues/

[Edited 11/13/19 8:48am]

It's easier to just vomit Fox lies like "he's weak on civil rights".

"If we had had confidence the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so."
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Reply #37 posted 11/13/19 3:05pm

PennyPurple

avatar

lazycrockett said:

poppys said:

You really don't get it. Bernie is not a Democrat, he is an Independent. BUT, he could be NOMINATED by the Dems and therefore have an actual chance at winning. Which is what he is trying to do. And if he gets the nomination, I will vote for him. I will vote for whoever gets the Dem nomination because that is the only candidate that can beat Republicans in 2020. Capiche?

If you don't, review The Electoral College system, our President is not elected by the poplular vote or we wouldn't have Trump in the first place.

And I think Buttigieg would at least make a decent VP. That's my educated opinion.

If you want to win the EC you have to go through the midwest. Too far left and you've lost them. M4A will not play well with unions who have negotiated for healthcare over wage increase. Taking that away with a policy that that could be easily overturned by the next GOP controlled Government scares the shit out of people, rightfully so.

Bible Belt is thru the midwest. They normally only vote Repub. I'm afraid the Bible Belt won't vote for Mayor Pete. I can almost say with certainty that they won't vote for Mayor Pete.

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Reply #38 posted 11/13/19 4:50pm

13cjk13

PennyPurple said:

lazycrockett said:

If you want to win the EC you have to go through the midwest. Too far left and you've lost them. M4A will not play well with unions who have negotiated for healthcare over wage increase. Taking that away with a policy that that could be easily overturned by the next GOP controlled Government scares the shit out of people, rightfully so.

Bible Belt is thru the midwest. They normally only vote Repub. I'm afraid the Bible Belt won't vote for Mayor Pete. I can almost say with certainty that they won't vote for Mayor Pete.

They actually wont vote for ANY Democrat, so there is that. biggrin

"If we had had confidence the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so."
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Reply #39 posted 11/13/19 5:11pm

PennyPurple

avatar

13cjk13 said:

PennyPurple said:

Bible Belt is thru the midwest. They normally only vote Repub. I'm afraid the Bible Belt won't vote for Mayor Pete. I can almost say with certainty that they won't vote for Mayor Pete.

They actually wont vote for ANY Democrat, so there is that. biggrin

And they really aren't going to be voting for Mayor Pete.

We are talking about the people who like to Preach the Bible, but don't practice what they Preach. biggrin

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Reply #40 posted 11/13/19 6:08pm

lazycrockett

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The majority if Union members voted for Obama in 2008. Its possible.

The Most Important Thing In Life Is Sincerity....Once You Can Fake That, You Can Fake Anything.
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Reply #41 posted 11/13/19 6:25pm

PennyPurple

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lazycrockett said:

The majority if Union members voted for Obama in 2008. Its possible.

The Unions, (at least in KC with FORD and GM) normally vote for the Dems. The repubs are against unions and try to bust them up.

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Reply #42 posted 11/14/19 8:43am

poppys

jaawwnn said:

poppys said:

You really don't get it. Bernie is not a Democrat, he is an Independent. BUT, he could be NOMINATED by the Dems and therefore have an actual chance at winning. Which is what he is trying to do. And if he gets the nomination, I will vote for him. I will vote for whoever gets the Dem nomination because that is the only candidate that can beat Republicans in 2020. Capiche?

Yes, that was my understanding of it 12 months ago until you started telling me it was impossible because of your very complicated primary system.

Yes I know that, I know how that system works, and I remember all the talk that they might defy the voters' wishes and refuse to elect Trump and it all came to nothing.


And I think Buttigieg would at least make a decent VP. That's my educated opinion.

I'd probably share that opinion shrug


I don't click on blind links anymore Jaawwnn, bad experiences, so I don't know what you've posted.

Recalled part of what we were discussing about the primaries, which vary from state to state. For instance, if you are an Independent or a Republican living in a closed primary state, you can't vote for Bernie in the primary, only Democrats can vote.

Therefore, his chances are less because he is an Independent and did not join the Democratic party, even though he seeks their nomination. I don't like it, but that's the way it is. Which is why I started out as an Independent years ago but switched to Dem so I could vote in primaries.

https://www.thoughtco.com...ry-3367495

There are open primaries and closed primaries, and several kinds of primaries in between the two. Perhaps the most talked-about primary in modern history is the open primary, which advocates say encourages voter participation. More than a dozen states hold open primaries.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #43 posted 11/14/19 11:59am

13cjk13

PennyPurple said:

13cjk13 said:

They actually wont vote for ANY Democrat, so there is that. biggrin

And they really aren't going to be voting for Mayor Pete.

We are talking about the people who like to Preach the Bible, but don't practice what they Preach. biggrin

I'm a firm believer that they really aren't going to be voting for ANY Democrat.

"If we had had confidence the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so."
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Reply #44 posted 11/14/19 3:22pm

PennyPurple

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13cjk13 said:

PennyPurple said:

And they really aren't going to be voting for Mayor Pete.

We are talking about the people who like to Preach the Bible, but don't practice what they Preach. biggrin

I'm a firm believer that they really aren't going to be voting for ANY Democrat.

I do not disagree with your statement at all, however I have a tiny bit of hope that they will open their eyes where fuck face is concerned.

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Reply #45 posted 11/14/19 3:36pm

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

PennyPurple said:

13cjk13 said:

I'm a firm believer that they really aren't going to be voting for ANY Democrat.

I do not disagree with your statement at all, however I have a tiny bit of hope that they will open their eyes where fuck face is concerned.


Placing hope on Independents as well. beg

"Families are torn apart, men women and children are separated. Children come home from school to find their parents have gone missing." - Anne Frank
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Reply #46 posted 11/15/19 2:23am

jaawwnn

avatar

poppys said:


Bullshit. I've known how the system works for years. I'm as old as Prince, dude.

There was a misunderstanding somewhere along the way, i'm not accusing you of lying. I could go back and find the posts if you like but I don't think it's worth our time .

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Reply #47 posted 11/15/19 5:46am

poppys

jaawwnn said:

poppys said:


Bullshit. I've known how the system works for years. I'm as old as Prince, dude.


There was a misunderstanding somewhere along the way, i'm not accusing you of lying. I could go back and find the posts if you like but I don't think it's worth our time .

Tried to address what I remembered yesterday in reply #42. We're good, and I hope we can continue to discuss, sparring aside.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #48 posted 11/15/19 8:27am

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

Now that Buttigeig is polling higher he will become a target for everyone. Which is good. We need to see how/if he can handle the pressure. We've seen candidates who looked great on paper on to break under pressure late in the game. And we have seen candidates like Obama who stepped it up when he was under attack and under pressure and do it all with grace and aplomb.

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Reply #49 posted 11/15/19 8:41am

jjhunsecker

avatar

BombSquad said:



OnlyNDaUsa said:



joe is a racist and criminal





then he has good chance for winning, that's what that orange fat fuck pedophile rapist traitor taught us


and what sentence did I miss? when was he convicted?

or are you again making stuff up, like normally just a phony shitty desperate pathetic scumbag liar would? inquiring minds want to know

and that coming from the very same hypocritic fraud, who claims he does not like the orange fat fuck, and just defends him against "lies" others make up about it. hilarious!


[Edited 11/13/19 5:29am]


https://nytimes.app.goo.g...amp;_icp=1
And why is Biden a "racist " ? Because he mentioned most Dunkin Donut franchises are owned by Indians and Pakistanis- which is an observable fact and not an opinion
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Reply #50 posted 11/15/19 8:51am

13cjk13

jjhunsecker said:

BombSquad said:

then he has good chance for winning, that's what that orange fat fuck pedophile rapist traitor taught us


and what sentence did I miss? when was he convicted?

or are you again making stuff up, like normally just a phony shitty desperate pathetic scumbag liar would? inquiring minds want to know

and that coming from the very same hypocritic fraud, who claims he does not like the orange fat fuck, and just defends him against "lies" others make up about it. hilarious!


[Edited 11/13/19 5:29am]

https://nytimes.app.goo.g...amp;_icp=1 And why is Biden a "racist " ? Because he mentioned most Dunkin Donut franchises are owned by Indians and Pakistanis- which is an observable fact and not an opinion

No, because Fox "news" and Breitbart said he is. No facts needed.

"If we had had confidence the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so."
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Reply #51 posted 11/15/19 10:59am

jjhunsecker

avatar

13cjk13 said:



jjhunsecker said:


BombSquad said:



then he has good chance for winning, that's what that orange fat fuck pedophile rapist traitor taught us


and what sentence did I miss? when was he convicted?

or are you again making stuff up, like normally just a phony shitty desperate pathetic scumbag liar would? inquiring minds want to know

and that coming from the very same hypocritic fraud, who claims he does not like the orange fat fuck, and just defends him against "lies" others make up about it. hilarious!



[Edited 11/13/19 5:29am]



https://nytimes.app.goo.g...amp;_icp=1 And why is Biden a "racist " ? Because he mentioned most Dunkin Donut franchises are owned by Indians and Pakistanis- which is an observable fact and not an opinion

No, because Fox "news" and Breitbart said he is. No facts needed.



And you'll notice that poster has never once called Trump a "racist " or a criminal, when he is demonstrably both
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Reply #52 posted 11/15/19 1:43pm

13cjk13

jjhunsecker said:

13cjk13 said:

No, because Fox "news" and Breitbart said he is. No facts needed.

And you'll notice that poster has never once called Trump a "racist " or a criminal, when he is demonstrably both

Yep, I think he is just fine with the old pussy grabber.

"If we had had confidence the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so."
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Reply #53 posted 11/15/19 3:16pm

PennyPurple

avatar

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

Now that Buttigeig is polling higher he will become a target for everyone. Which is good. We need to see how/if he can handle the pressure. We've seen candidates who looked great on paper on to break under pressure late in the game. And we have seen candidates like Obama who stepped it up when he was under attack and under pressure and do it all with grace and aplomb.

Mayor Pete will NOT get the nod. Like others, I think he would make a great VP.

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Reply #54 posted 11/16/19 12:07pm

poppys

Fits right in the topic of why Buttigieg is first in Iowa right now.

https://www.huffpost.com/...474817be15

WASHINGTON (AP) — Former President Barack Obama on Friday warned the Democratic field of White House hopefuls not to veer too far to the left, a move he said would alienate many who would otherwise be open to voting for the party’s nominee next year.

Though Obama did not mention anyone by name, the message delivered before a room of Democratic donors in Washington was a clear word of caution about the candidacies of Sens. Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders. The two have called for massive structural changes — and in Sanders’ case “revolution” — that would dramatically alter the role of government in people's lives.


The centrist wing of the party has warned for months that a far-left nominee could alienate moderate Republicans and independent voters needed to oust President Donald Trump.

“The average American doesn’t think we have to completely tear down the system and remake it. And I think it’s important for us not to lose sight of that,” Obama said. “There are a lot of persuadable voters and there are a lot of Democrats out there who just want to see things make sense. They just don’t want to see crazy stuff. They want to see things a little more fair, they want to see things a little more just. And how we approach that I think will be important.”

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #55 posted 11/16/19 12:42pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

poppys said:

Fits right in the topic of why Buttigieg is first in Iowa right now.

https://www.huffpost.com/...474817be15

WASHINGTON (AP) — Former President Barack Obama on Friday warned the Democratic field of White House hopefuls not to veer too far to the left, a move he said would alienate many who would otherwise be open to voting for the party’s nominee next year.

Though Obama did not mention anyone by name, the message delivered before a room of Democratic donors in Washington was a clear word of caution about the candidacies of Sens. Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders. The two have called for massive structural changes — and in Sanders’ case “revolution” — that would dramatically alter the role of government in people's lives.


The centrist wing of the party has warned for months that a far-left nominee could alienate moderate Republicans and independent voters needed to oust President Donald Trump.

“The average American doesn’t think we have to completely tear down the system and remake it. And I think it’s important for us not to lose sight of that,” Obama said. “There are a lot of persuadable voters and there are a lot of Democrats out there who just want to see things make sense. They just don’t want to see crazy stuff. They want to see things a little more fair, they want to see things a little more just. And how we approach that I think will be important.”

He's absolutely right. And even if a candidate wants major change, why scare people with proposals that will take many years at the very least and instead work towards those objective with quantitative milestones to show your constituency and continued support.

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Reply #56 posted 11/16/19 1:44pm

poppys

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

poppys said:

Fits right in the topic of why Buttigieg is first in Iowa right now.

https://www.huffpost.com/...474817be15

WASHINGTON (AP) — Former President Barack Obama on Friday warned the Democratic field of White House hopefuls not to veer too far to the left, a move he said would alienate many who would otherwise be open to voting for the party’s nominee next year.

Though Obama did not mention anyone by name, the message delivered before a room of Democratic donors in Washington was a clear word of caution about the candidacies of Sens. Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders. The two have called for massive structural changes — and in Sanders’ case “revolution” — that would dramatically alter the role of government in people's lives.


The centrist wing of the party has warned for months that a far-left nominee could alienate moderate Republicans and independent voters needed to oust President Donald Trump.

“The average American doesn’t think we have to completely tear down the system and remake it. And I think it’s important for us not to lose sight of that,” Obama said. “There are a lot of persuadable voters and there are a lot of Democrats out there who just want to see things make sense. They just don’t want to see crazy stuff. They want to see things a little more fair, they want to see things a little more just. And how we approach that I think will be important.”


He's absolutely right. And even if a candidate wants major change, why scare people with proposals that will take many years at the very least and instead work towards those objective with quantitative milestones to show your constituency and continued support.


Agree. People are tired of big moves and uncertainty, especially now.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #57 posted 11/16/19 2:53pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

PennyPurple said:

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

Now that Buttigeig is polling higher he will become a target for everyone. Which is good. We need to see how/if he can handle the pressure. We've seen candidates who looked great on paper on to break under pressure late in the game. And we have seen candidates like Obama who stepped it up when he was under attack and under pressure and do it all with grace and aplomb.

Mayor Pete will NOT get the nod. Like others, I think he would make a great VP.

I agree that Buttigeig does not have that like-ability/charm that Bernie/Warren/Obama have. Heck even Trump has that weird je ne sais quoi that motivates his base beyond reason.
.

Buttigueg is smart and is able to clearly explain his positions, but I don't know if he can ever command that crazy devotion. But then again, as we've seen with Trump, Jim Jones and the like, it's not necessarily healthy to be so devoted to sip on the kool aid without question.

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Reply #58 posted 11/16/19 11:02pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

Latest CNN poll sees Buttigeig still leading Iowa with growing margins.

Glad to hear as the so-called progressives and concerns over their viability/inability to win were causing new candidates to jump in for fear of major loss to Trump.
This should quell some of those concerns.

Pete Buttigieg surges to first place in Iowa, new poll shows

https://www.cnn.com/2019/...index.html

CNN)There is a new Democratic front-runner in Iowa, and his name is Pete Buttigieg.

The mayor of South Bend, Indiana, holds a clear lead in the first-in-the-nation caucus state, climbing to 25% in a new CNN/Des Moines Regist...aucusgoers. That marks a 16-point increase in support for Buttigieg since the September CNN/DMR poll. This survey comes on the heels of other recent polls that have shown Buttigieg joining the top tier of the Democratic primary race in Iowa.
Behind Buttigieg, there is a close three-way battle for second with Massachusetts Sen. Elizabeth Warren at 16%, and former Vice President Joe Biden and Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders each at 15%. Since September, Warren dropped six percentage points and Biden slipped five points, while Sanders gained four points.

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Reply #59 posted 11/17/19 3:23am

jaawwnn

avatar

lazycrockett said:



poppys said:


You really don't get it. Bernie is not a Democrat, he is an Independent. BUT, he could be NOMINATED by the Dems and therefore have an actual chance at winning. Which is what he is trying to do. And if he gets the nomination, I will vote for him. I will vote for whoever gets the Dem nomination because that is the only candidate that can beat Republicans in 2020. Capiche?

If you don't, review The Electoral College system, our President is not elected by the poplular vote or we wouldn't have Trump in the first place.

And I think Buttigieg would at least make a decent VP. That's my educated opinion.



If you want to win the EC you have to go through the midwest. Too far left and you've lost them. M4A will not play well with unions who have negotiated for healthcare over wage increase. Taking that away with a policy that that could be easily overturned by the next GOP controlled Government scares the shit out of people, rightfully so.


The Conservatives in the UK have been trying for 50 years to overturn Medicare for All and haven't managed yet because its too popular. If you just bow to the Republicans before you've even started you'll never win.
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Forums > Politics & Religion > Poll: Buttigieg first in Iowa Joe Biden and Elizabeth Warren are close behind,