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Thread started 11/12/19 10:57am

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

Poll: Buttigieg first in Iowa Joe Biden and Elizabeth Warren are close behind,

I knew he would slowly creep up as he is the strongest candidate policy and intelligence wise.

Establishment progressive media is upset that their their candidates are losing steam to a relative unknown who isn't part of their clique.

Poll: Buttigieg first in Iowa

Joe Biden and Elizabeth Warren are close behind, with Bernie Sanders in fourth place.
https://www.politico.com/...oll-069853

Pete Buttigieg, whose presidential campaign has been steadily gaining ground in Iowa over recent weeks, now sits narrowly atop the 2020 Democratic field in the first-in-the-nation caucus state, according to a new survey.

A Monmouth University poll published Tuesday shows that the South Bend, Ind., mayor is the first choice of 22 percent of likely Democratic caucus-goers — outrunning all other rivals in Iowa for the party’s nomination to challenge President Donald Trump.

.

Former Vice President Joe Biden ranks in second place with 19 percent support, followed closely by Sen. Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts with 18 percent and Sen. Bernie Sanders of Vermont with 13 percent.

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Reply #1 posted 11/12/19 4:23pm

PennyPurple

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I like him. I'd vote for him, but again it is going to be a long road ahead of him, dealing with the Bible Belt.

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Reply #2 posted 11/12/19 5:31pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

PennyPurple said:

I like him. I'd vote for him, but again it is going to be a long road ahead of him, dealing with the Bible Belt.

i like him too, but I worry about how he will handle pressure. Also as with congresswoman Katie Hill, will he cave under pressure if his sex life comes under attack?
.
He will also face a lot of pressure to live up to the standard and mixed expectations as the first major out gay candidate. Even from the gay community itself.

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Reply #3 posted 11/12/19 5:41pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

In this hyper partisan time and with many Republicans wanting an option to the repugnant abomination that is Trump, far left candidates like Bernie and Warren made it difficult for them to vote for anyone else but Trump and still be at peace with their political beliefs.

...And that's where Buttigeig comes in if he can pull it off.

Buttigieg woos 'future former Republicans' in wide-open N.H. primary

Candidates are targeting the tens of thousands of non-Democrats who can vote in New Hampshire's close Democratic primary

https://www.politico.com/...ary-070286

.

ROCHESTER, N.H. — As Pete Buttigieg boarded his campaign bus Monday afternoon, a New Hampshire voter stopped him to ask if campaign staffers were hawking “Republicans for Pete” stickers yet.

They aren’t. But Buttigieg, who’s staking out center-left ground in the Democratic presidential primary, is trying to build a coalition of unaffiliated voters to go along with Democrats and make a surprise splash in the open-primary state featuring two senators-next-door, Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren, campaigning on the left.

.

At town halls during his latest swing across New Hampshire, Buttigieg name-checked “future former Republicans” in the same breath as “progressives and moderates ... ready for some kind of change.” His organizers are targeting independent voters from the new field offices Buttigieg opened this fall. And while Buttigieg is polling well in both Iowa and New Hampshire right now, jockeying for first place in the caucus state and breaking into double-digits in several recent polls of each state, the presence of non-Democrats in the New Hampshire Democratic primary — unlike Iowa’s closed caucus system — could prove decisive in a tight Democratic nominating race that has divided sharply along ideological lines in recent months.

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Reply #4 posted 11/12/19 7:31pm

poppys

Interesting. He'd make a great VP too if not the nomination.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #5 posted 11/13/19 1:55am

jaawwnn

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The man stands for nothing and he will sell you out the moment the money shifts that way. Current Affairs had his number way back in March.

Take his stance on healthcare for example: https://twitter.com/wideo...2206231553. He comes across as completely believable in both clips.


If you're pro-business rights over human rights (if you were forced to choose), pro-status-quo and thought everything was fine under Obama he's your man though.




[Edited 11/13/19 1:56am]

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Reply #6 posted 11/13/19 4:13am

OnlyNDaUsa

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I don not know much about Buttigieg other than he is weak on civil rights.

joe is a racist and criminal

Liz is a communist that will make you (if she got her wish) much less comfortable... oh maybe you will FEEL like you are better off...
people who are oppressed often do *when we all suffer, suffering becomes the norm and we feel like things are fair*


No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #7 posted 11/13/19 4:18am

OnlyNDaUsa

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jaawwnn said:

The man stands for nothing and he will sell you out the moment the money shifts that way. Current Affairs had his number way back in March.

Take his stance on healthcare for example: https://twitter.com/wideo...2206231553. He comes across as completely believable in both clips.


If you're pro-business rights over human rights (if you were forced to choose), pro-status-quo and thought everything was fine under Obama he's your man though.




[Edited 11/13/19 1:56am]

Strawman! Without a robust system of revenues (best--only--created and maintained by a (mostly) free market) there is no sustainable social safety net.

Business MUST be allowed to make money to pay for the cost of people who need help. Oh and not not fall for the lie that these big companies pay no taxes... that is just a narrow minded fool's remark. They pay pleanty--some directly...some indirectly.

No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #8 posted 11/13/19 4:39am

BombSquad

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OnlyNDaUsa said:


joe is a racist and criminal

then he has good chance for winning, that's what that orange fat fuck pedophile rapist traitor taught us


and what sentence did I miss? when was he convicted?

or are you again making stuff up, like normally just a phony shitty desperate pathetic scumbag liar would? inquiring minds want to know

and that coming from the very same hypocritic fraud, who claims he does not like the orange fat fuck, and just defends him against "lies" others make up about it. hilarious!


[Edited 11/13/19 5:29am]

Ideally speaking, the President of the United States and the dumbest person in the country would be two different people. Oh well.... money can't fix stupid
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Reply #9 posted 11/13/19 4:43am

BombSquad

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OnlyNDaUsa said:

Liz is a communist

more ignorance and obviously a total lack of political education. as always just parroting P.A.R.A.N.O.I.D. idiotic Fox dumbfuck talkpoints without having the slightest clue himself. what a tool LOL


[Edited 11/13/19 4:59am]

Ideally speaking, the President of the United States and the dumbest person in the country would be two different people. Oh well.... money can't fix stupid
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Reply #10 posted 11/13/19 4:53am

jaawwnn

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OnlyNDaUsa said:

jaawwnn said:

The man stands for nothing and he will sell you out the moment the money shifts that way. Current Affairs had his number way back in March.

Take his stance on healthcare for example: https://twitter.com/wideo...2206231553. He comes across as completely believable in both clips.


If you're pro-business rights over human rights (if you were forced to choose), pro-status-quo and thought everything was fine under Obama he's your man though.




[Edited 11/13/19 1:56am]

Strawman! Without a robust system of revenues (best--only--created and maintained by a (mostly) free market) there is no sustainable social safety net.


strawman. shrug

Business MUST be allowed to make money to pay for the cost of people who need help. Oh and not not fall for the lie that these big companies pay no taxes... that is just a narrow minded fool's remark. They pay pleanty--some directly...some indirectly.

Ok boomer. Once we start saying businesses must be allowed make money then we're fairly arguing for my alleged strawman argument.

As someone who lives in a tax-haven I can tell you that big companies pay little to no taxes. My government is currently appealing an order by the EU to tax companies. Yep, we're suing for the right to not tax companies.



[Edited 11/13/19 5:00am]

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Reply #11 posted 11/13/19 5:24am

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

.
[Edited 11/13/19 5:51am]
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Reply #12 posted 11/13/19 5:56am

jaawwnn

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Ugot2shakesumthin said:

jaawwnn said:

You’re a tax haven. You only survive for that reason. You’re suing for your survival. You have nothing if you aren’t that.

You think I don't know that? Our system is completely pegged to outside business, if these companies pull out we've made no preperations on how to survive. It's an awful, untenable, stupid position to put your country in but here we are. We already suffered badly in 2008, apparently we learnt nothing though.

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Reply #13 posted 11/13/19 6:51am

poppys

jaawwnn said:

The man stands for nothing and he will sell you out the moment the money shifts that way. Current Affairs had his number way back in March.

Take his stance on healthcare for example: https://twitter.com/wideo...2206231553. He comes across as completely believable in both clips.

If you're pro-business rights over human rights (if you were forced to choose), pro-status-quo and thought everything was fine under Obama he's your man though.


Yes, we are forced to choose if we want Trump out. You're still refusing to accept the state we are in here, and fail to understand that the perfect is the enemy of the good in this election. ONE person will be nominated that has a chance of beating Trump. I'll take the civility of Obama over someone who cannot win any day. This is not a shopping trip where we get to choose our favorite and take it home. Notice how I don't tell you about your election choices? Presumptuous idealist.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #14 posted 11/13/19 7:08am

jaawwnn

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poppys said:


Yes, we are forced to choose if we want Trump out. You're still refusing to accept the state we are in here, and fail to understand that the perfect is the enemy of the good in this election. ONE person will be nominated that has a chance of beating Trump. I'll take the civility of Obama over someone who cannot win any day. This is not a shopping trip where we get to choose our favorite and take it home. Notice how I don't tell you about your election choices? Presumptuous idealist.

I'll agree to differ with you on Mayor Pete since by my reckoning, out of him, Biden, Warren and Sanders he's the least likely to beat Trump. He's got close to zero support amongst people of colour and the working class of America and while he might share some of the intellectual ambitions as Obama he completely lacks the charisma. Trump will just continue to call him Alfred E. Neuman and will sail through.

As for the rest, sadly, the USA holds such cultural, political, economical and military power over the rest of the planet we have no choice but to follow your election with some level of investment. We've already got a few Trump style politicians popping up over here, returning to a racist language not seen in over a decade, and they wouldn't be doing it if Trump hadn't been elected and shown them a new way. I'd be happy to discuss my local politics with you if you cared, which you don't. Us voicing our opinions on your politics is the price you have to pay for having an empire.

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Reply #15 posted 11/13/19 7:19am

DiminutiveRock
er

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woot! Mayor Pete!

"Families are torn apart, men women and children are separated. Children come home from school to find their parents have gone missing." - Anne Frank
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Reply #16 posted 11/13/19 7:33am

poppys

jaawwnn said:

poppys said:


Yes, we are forced to choose if we want Trump out. You're still refusing to accept the state we are in here, and fail to understand that the perfect is the enemy of the good in this election. ONE person will be nominated that has a chance of beating Trump. I'll take the civility of Obama over someone who cannot win any day. This is not a shopping trip where we get to choose our favorite and take it home. Notice how I don't tell you about your election choices? Presumptuous idealist.

I'll agree to differ with you on Mayor Pete since by my reckoning, out of him, Biden, Warren and Sanders he's the least likely to beat Trump. He's got close to zero support amongst people of colour and the working class of America and while he might share some of the intellectual ambitions as Obama he completely lacks the charisma. Trump will just continue to call him Alfred E. Neuman and will sail through.

As for the rest, sadly, the USA holds such cultural, political, economical and military power over the rest of the planet we have no choice but to follow your election with some level of investment. We've already got a few Trump style politicians popping up over here, returning to a racist language not seen in over a decade, and they wouldn't be doing it if Trump hadn't been elected and shown them a new way. I'd be happy to discuss my local politics with you if you cared, which you don't. Us voicing our opinions on your politics is the price you have to pay for having an empire.


This started because I said Buttigieg would make a good VP. It seems you barely read my posts. All of your info is secondhand and from polls. He actually does have a certain charisma, and common sense. Also military service.

Our elections are an easy target. It's our fault you got a Trump-like politician? No. If it's there, it was there all along. People ignore that this country was settled by Europeans. Everything in the world right now is the fault of a 243 year old country that will eventually lose the #1 position, like they all do. This is used everytime you are confronted with our actual reality by actual people who live and vote here. You never post about your elections, so that was an easy dismiss. This is just a game to you, an intellectual exercise, not a discussion. The needle never moves.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #17 posted 11/13/19 7:37am

2freaky4church
1

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Utter lie.

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #18 posted 11/13/19 7:47am

jaawwnn

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poppys said:


This started because I said Buttigieg would make a good VP. It seems you barely read my posts. All of your info is secondhand and from polls. He actually does have a certain charisma, and common sense. Also military service.

I never said you couldn't say he would be a good VP. I was responding to the thread, which is news about Iowa coming first in the polls. Most of my info comes from the article I posted arguing that he would be a terrible Democratic nominee/US President.


Our elections are an easy target. It's our fault you got a Trump-like politician? No. If it's there, it was there all along. People ignore that this country was settled by Europeans. Everything in the world right now is the fault of a 243 year old country that will eventually lose the #1 position, like they all do. This is used everytime you are confronted with our actual reality by actual people who live and vote here. You never post about your elections, so that was an easy dismiss. This is just a game to you, an intellectual exercise, not a discussion. The needle never moves.

What the hell are you talking about? Do I have to go through this sentence by sentence?

Your election is not a "target" for my "intellectual exercise" and i'm not "blaming" Trump for our politicans, what I am doing is demonstrating a direct causel relationshop between what happens in your country and what happens in mine. Every USA election is a hugely important election with worldwide ramifications including on my country. Similarly I have no direct say in Brexit despite it having a massive impact, people are already dying because of it. The Bernie Sanders campaigns from 2016 onwards have already led to a massive upsurge in left-leaning youth in my country, that's just how it works.

To spell it out for you, yes, your stupid election that I wish I could ignore will have literal life and death consequences for people in my country so yes, i'm fucking invested in who wins.

[Edited 11/13/19 7:50am]

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Reply #19 posted 11/13/19 8:14am

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

OnlyNDaUsa said:

I don not know much about Buttigieg other than he is weak on civil rights.

joe is a racist and criminal

Liz is a communist that will make you (if she got her wish) much less comfortable... oh maybe you will FEEL like you are better off...
people who are oppressed often do *when we all suffer, suffering becomes the norm and we feel like things are fair*


Funny how you never use those descriptions for Trump himself. Especially as he is certainly those things. At least comparatively.

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Reply #20 posted 11/13/19 8:19am

lazycrockett

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Maybe before people start bashing Pete, they should take a look at his platform. His Douglass Plan is the most progressive on racial issues in decades.

https://peteforamerica.com/issues/

[Edited 11/13/19 8:48am]

The Most Important Thing In Life Is Sincerity....Once You Can Fake That, You Can Fake Anything.
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Reply #21 posted 11/13/19 8:26am

poppys

jaawwnn said:

To spell it out for you, yes, your stupid election that I wish I could ignore will have literal life and death consequences for people in my country so yes, i'm fucking invested in who wins.


In that case, maybe you should try to understand what people who live and vote here are saying about our system, and what is possible in 2020. Instead of dictating your view from abroad - and then getting angry when you are challenged.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #22 posted 11/13/19 8:54am

jaawwnn

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poppys said:

jaawwnn said:

To spell it out for you, yes, your stupid election that I wish I could ignore will have literal life and death consequences for people in my country so yes, i'm fucking invested in who wins.


In that case, maybe you should try to understand what people who live and vote here are saying about our system, and what is possible in 2020. Instead of dictating your view from abroad - and then getting angry when you are challenged.

I've already posted an article by someone who lives and votes in the US who argues against voting for Pete. That information is there if anyone wants to read it, I find it more persuasive than anything else written on here.

All i've been arguing with you over is my right to have an opinion and your constant personal attacks on my intentions and character. Which is fine, I don't mind having the argument, but I reserve the right to get angry over it.


[Edited 11/13/19 8:55am]

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Reply #23 posted 11/13/19 9:08am

poppys

jaawwnn said:

poppys said:

jaawwnn said:

To spell it out for you, yes, your stupid election that I wish I could ignore will have literal life and death consequences for people in my country so yes, i'm fucking invested in who wins.


In that case, maybe you should try to understand what people who live and vote here are saying about our system, and what is possible in 2020. Instead of dictating your view from abroad - and then getting angry when you are challenged.

I've already posted an article by someone who lives and votes in the US who argues against voting for Pete. That information is there if anyone wants to read it, I find it more persuasive than anything else written on here.

All i've been arguing with you over is my right to have an opinion and your constant personal attacks on my intentions and character. Which is fine, I don't mind having the argument, but I reserve the right to get angry over it.


I've tried to explain our election system to you many times with beaucoup links - for at least a year now. But I get the same old mindset
starting at zero - every time. You are attacking where I live with lots of opinions. Now you say I'm personally attacking you - I'm not buying it. You are angry at your ideas being challenged. That's fine.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #24 posted 11/13/19 9:29am

jaawwnn

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poppys said:


I've tried to explain our election system to you many times with beaucoup links - for at least a year now. But I get the same old mindset starting at zero - every time. You are attacking where I live with lots of opinions. Now you say I'm personally attacking you - I'm not buying it. You are angry at your ideas being challenged. That's fine.

How about you stop constantly telling me what I feel, what I think, and what I know? That'd be a real start.

I don't pretend to understand the full ins and outs of the ludicrous primary system, I followed up on all the stuff you posted and if I recall correctly you are saying people can't vote for Bernie because he's not a registered Democrat and therefore cannot be elected in a bunch of states. I straight up don't believe this, I think it would have occurred to him, his team and everyone who has endorsed him that if it was impossible for him to win over some technicality then his campaign would have been derailed years ago.

Here is an article by one of his staffers talking about what I believe is the issue at hand. It sounds like it's just harder for him to win but not impossible. Being that this is a primary and not the actual election I don't see why people who believe in Sanders shouldn't vote for him. Once again, I would say he has the best chance of beating Trump out of the top 4 Dem contendors, you may disagree over this and that's fine.





[Edited 11/13/19 9:33am]

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Reply #25 posted 11/13/19 9:42am

poppys

You really don't get it. Bernie is not a Democrat, he is an Independent. BUT, he could be NOMINATED by the Dems and therefore have an actual chance at winning. Which is what he is trying to do. And if he gets the nomination, I will vote for him. I will vote for whoever gets the Dem nomination because that is the only candidate that can beat Republicans in 2020. Capiche?

If you don't, review The Electoral College system, our President is not elected by the poplular vote or we wouldn't have Trump in the first place.

And I think Buttigieg would at least make a decent VP. That's my educated opinion.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #26 posted 11/13/19 9:43am

2freaky4church
1

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Moderates did give us Trump. Moderates would lose to a fascist as a way to thwart any progressive from winning. Pelosi is ready to deal with Trump again over Bernie. With her it is mostly about serving corporate power.

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #27 posted 11/13/19 9:47am

poppys

bored Throwing your vote away for whatever reason is everyone's right.

politics: the art or science of government.
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Reply #28 posted 11/13/19 9:50am

2freaky4church
1

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Votes don't matter.

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #29 posted 11/13/19 9:53am

jaawwnn

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poppys said:

You really don't get it. Bernie is not a Democrat, he is an Independent. BUT, he could be NOMINATED by the Dems and therefore have an actual chance at winning. Which is what he is trying to do. And if he gets the nomination, I will vote for him. I will vote for whoever gets the Dem nomination because that is the only candidate that can beat Republicans in 2020. Capiche?

Yes, that was my understanding of it 12 months ago until you started telling me it was impossible because of your very complicated primary system.


If you don't, review The Electoral College system, our President is not elected by the poplular vote or we wouldn't have Trump in the first place.

Yes I know that, I know how that system works, and I remember all the talk that they might defy the voters' wishes and refuse to elect Trump and it all came to nothing.


And I think Buttigieg would at least make a decent VP. That's my educated opinion.

I'd probably share that opinion shrug

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Forums > Politics & Religion > Poll: Buttigieg first in Iowa Joe Biden and Elizabeth Warren are close behind,