TweetyV6 said:
Speaking Out against racism is Not speaking for black people. You act like here's Not a single black Person speaking against this cartoon. "Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."
"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
The man of science has learned to believe in justification, not by faith, but by verification - Thomas Henry Huxley | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
About 'intent' I think Mark Knight's visible shock https://www.youtube.com/w...rDQ_tBfUBE in the face of the - social and other - media's overreaction to his cartoon pretty much says it all. Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
TweetyV6 said:
Oh Tweety, don’t you know that ‘White people can’t experience racism’ because ‘prejudice + power = racism’? You’re just gonna have to deal with people of other races bullying you, because your ancestors may or may not have done some fucked up shit. Sorry. You’re gonna have to get use to people being racist towards you, think of it as “payback”. I’m sure they think of it that way ”The people that will end up defining ‘Hate Speech Laws’ are the very people you don’t want to define the Hate Speech Laws” — Jordan B Peterson | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
Kinda sucks when the chickens come home to roost. Poor little snowflakes. Womp Womp........ "If we had had confidence the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so." | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
. I assume you are being sarcastic? . This is just the normal toejam edit and miss the point post. . Note he edits out "Knight’s cartoon conjures up a range of such caricatures that were branded on memorabilia and popularized on stage and screen of the era, including the minstrel-show character Topsy born out of “Uncle Tom’s Cabin,” as well as the title character in 1899’s “Little Black Sambo.” " Why? Because this is the argument everyone else has been making here and toejam needed to pretend no one has been answering him satisafactorily. Because, obviously, a lone far-right white male from Australia's "Deep North" is the person that is responsible for determining whether a depiction of a person not of his race, country, gender etc etc is racist. By shortening this sentence, he can make it seem that the baby depiction part of caricature is all that should be seen. It is not. . He uses the same edit trick again in his attempt to dismiss comments about Naomi's depiction by getting you to disregard them because the author does not stand by them because he says "some critics say..." The reason for the "..." is Cavna goes on to immediately quote one of these critics: "Author J.K. Rowling wrote on Twitter: “Well done on reducing one of the greatest sportswomen alive to racist and sexist tropes and turning a second great sportswoman into a faceless prop.”" Hardly a backtrack. It is consistent with the whole article as it is not an op ed, it is a summary of what others are saying. Toejam, himself, saw Japanese racial stereotyping in Naomi merely standing up (despite this being nothing of the sort and Naomi is Haitian-Japanese). His skin colour assessment asks us to believe all whites are always drawn using the same shade and blonde hair all over is accurate enough despite Naomi's hair being mainly very dark. . The worst part of toejam's clarity is that, yes, it does display clarity of the type of assessment being made. Nick Kyrgios (an Australian with Malaysian and Greek parents) has been depicted disparagingly for his rants. The difference is he is less exaggerated and not in a racist way that draws directly on the type of depictions mentioned in the WP article that toejam edited out with his first "...". It is a caricature that does not cross the line to being racist. . This clarity of assessment is exacerbated by toejam discussing Knight's previous controversial racist depiction. For those outside of Australia, there was a far-right beat up and race based scare campaign promoted by certain media outlets like Sky News and the Herald Sun in Melbourne. As discussed above, the Herald Sun (including Knight) panders to their audience and they were promoting the idea that there is a more serious black gang violence problem in Melbourne than there really is. Kenyan and South Sudanese born gang violence exists in Melbourne, no question. However, you are 25 times more likely to be violently assaulted by an Australian or New Zealand born person. Kenyan and South Sudanese people make up a very small portion of the population. They are generally refugees. Gang violence by these refugees is broadly in proportion with similar age and economic condition groups in Melbourne. The cartoon was promoting the idea that the lampooned politician was hiding the threat of gang violence - Shown solely as by black faceless youth and not the actual mix that would show it being done by mostly white youth. Hardly such a convincing defence of the political cartoonist leaving nothing more to say. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
^Sorry to disappoint you Ian, but there was absolutely no sarcasm in my post to toejam. Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
. No problem, that is what I figured anyway. I was just giving you the opportunity to reconsider you opinion that toejam's post was 'drop the mike' good. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
TweetyV6 said:
Because I hate racism, I could give you a way deeper answer, but you don't give a fuck anyway and I'm not wasting my time with it Just for you to say: "They didn't ask you to speak for them". Because this is your argument to go If you have nothing else against me. "Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."
"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
The man of science has learned to believe in justification, not by faith, but by verification - Thomas Henry Huxley | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
. On the contrary, that is exactly what toejam is doing one way or the other - He associates clearly racist depictions of African Americans as nothing more exaggerations of reality whilst overinterpreting a person standing up to talk to a Ref high up on a chair as a "a typically 'Japanese' pose and demeanor" - His very words. He went so far in his over-interpretation to create a picture so he could argue that the lightly tanned white blonde woman was supposed to be quite dark skinned and dark haired (except for the dyed bottom part of her ponytail) Naomi Osaka. . That the group of clearly black people are faceless is irrelevant - the political agenda of Herald Sun and its political cartoonist, Knight, was to promote a scare campaign against refugees by overemphasising violence by some Kenyan and South Sudan born people in Melbourne - when the vast majority of street violence in Melbourne is by Australians and New Zealanders. This is a far right agenda - in my area the New South Wales sister publication to the Herald Sun helped support and promote people to travel to my area from Sydney to protest a Mosque being built here because few here were concerned. They did the same when South Sudanese refugees were being placed in my area, again with little local concern. . To borrow from another argumentative tennis player - you can't be serious that all of us are just blindly following JK Rowling. Not a fan of her, or her books and I did not know what she said till after I saw the political cartoon and did not need to know what she said to recognise it as racist. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
IanRG said:
. On the contrary, that is exactly what toejam is doing one way or the other - He associates clearly racist depictions of African Americans as nothing more exaggerations of reality whilst overinterpreting a person standing up to talk to a Ref high up on a chair as a "a typically 'Japanese' pose and demeanor" - His very words. He went so far in his over-interpretation to create a picture so he could argue that the lightly tanned white blonde woman was supposed to be quite dark skinned and dark haired (except for the dyed bottom part of her ponytail) Naomi Osaka. . That the group of clearly black people are faceless is irrelevant - the political agenda of Herald Sun and its political cartoonist, Knight, was to promote a scare campaign against refugees by overemphasising violence by some Kenyan and South Sudan born people in Melbourne - when the vast majority of street violence in Melbourne is by Australians and New Zealanders. This is a far right agenda - in my area the New South Wales sister publication to the Herald Sun helped support and promote people to travel to my area from Sydney to protest a Mosque being built here because few here were concerned. They did the same when South Sudanese refugees were being placed in my area, again with little local concern. . To borrow from another argumentative tennis player - you can't be serious that all of us are just blindly following JK Rowling. Not a fan of her, or her books and I did not know what she said till after I saw the political cartoon and did not need to know what she said to recognise it as racist. Good Post IanRG "Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."
"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
First of all TweetyV6 it is called a mosque, not a mosk. Getting that wrong makes you look ignorant. . Rest of you - stop all this sniping - this is the prince.org not SJW vs the Free Speech Mob, let us live Prince's mantra - LOVE4ONEANOTHER. It starts by loving the next person u r verbally sparring with over some celebrity sportsperson bullshit. . "Love vs Hate, Love will always win" - TAFKAP Quote on the single cover of I hate U. This is the place where emotions grow. 24 Feelings all in a row, its alright, its alright | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
. Nothing in the stated opinion (it was not a demonstration) showed that the political cartoon was not clearly racist - This is just confirmational bias: you agree with a person, so their arguments are drop the mike moments to you. The way Naomi Osaka was referred to in the opinion is stereotyping based on her assumed (but half incorrect) race/culture, just as the way Serena was drawn is stereotyping her based on her race/culture. Yes, Naomi (drawn as a lightly tanned white, blonde woman) was shown positively whilst Serena (drawn in line with a long history of racist depictions of black women in western culture) was shown negatively. Seeking to create a differentiation between sterotyping by race vs stereotyping by culture avoids the issue is neither here nor there. Importantly Nick was not racially stereotyped by Knight when he was shown negatively. . You miss my point, but in doing so agree with me: I was responding to you saying there was no overinterpretation through a biased racial lense on your side. I showed that there was, and you are now saying well OK but that should not be immediately criticised. . Racism is not going away and it certainly is not going to go away if everyone offended by the apparent racism in a simple cartoon just shuts up and looks away lest their stand against racism encourages more racism! . That you, as a person not from Australia, are unaware of a particular Australian Murdoch publication's agenda is not my concern. That you are not aware of Murdoch's political agenda in media world-wide is not believable. As a person from the UK, you should be well aware of the political agendas of the different publications in your country - the same applies to other countries. . You are being too dismissive of other's opinions and you are basing it on an already disputed false claim. I am not reliant at all on quoting JK Rowling, I just pointed out that toejam's post wrongly criticised an article about opinions expressed through the media about the political cartoon and cartoonist because, in discussing these opinions, the author said some of these argue ... . It is mere coincidence that the quote immediately following the "..." was from Rowling. Had I started with JK Rowling said ..., then you may have had an amazingly weak point, but I have many more straws in my hand than you have. [Edited 9/25/18 14:24pm] | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
. Throughout Prince's life and music, he also regularly encouraged us to show LOVE4ONEANOTHER by standing up for what is right and against assumptions and generalisations based on racism etc. . Discourse on contentious issues is not something Prince shied away from. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
Maybe - but the tone of the past 2 pages has got very ugly and personal. I am all for debate and standing up for justice and respect, but there are limits. This is the place where emotions grow. 24 Feelings all in a row, its alright, its alright | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
. By no means is this the worst thread where this is currently occuring - but I am all for toning down. The thread is arguably past its end anyway. | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
The man of science has learned to believe in justification, not by faith, but by verification - Thomas Henry Huxley | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
Well I have two words for you in my native language (Maori) and will not bother to translate them
Tutaeupoko and Pohokohua! . I thought the Dutch were open minded, are you Afrikaner? I mean you guys tolerate dope and prostitutes - thats forward (And fxxking daft). . Anyway you are the main shit stirrer. Even Serena has moved on, maybe we all should too - Ka haere koe kua mutu te korero. [Edited 9/26/18 1:18am] This is the place where emotions grow. 24 Feelings all in a row, its alright, its alright | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
The man of science has learned to believe in justification, not by faith, but by verification - Thomas Henry Huxley | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
brb with related comment 👀 [Edited 9/26/18 16:00pm] | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
[Edited 9/26/18 14:21pm] Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |
CherryMoon57 said:
[Edited 9/26/18 14:21pm] yet the entire video is reflective of a well spoken and intelligent woman. as a woman i am very proud of serena Williams and her accomplishments on and off the court. knowing she is in support of women's breast cancer research is awesome. her greatness as a woman and being documented as the greatest female tennis player of all time overshadows her on court meltdown. [Edited 9/28/18 12:07pm] | |
- E-mail - orgNote - ![]() |