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Reply #210 posted 09/21/18 1:36am

CherryMoon57

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free2bFreeda2 said:

[...] \so glad LeBron steps forward in support of Serena. seems here at the org those who continue to trivialize Serena outrage are not even citizens of the u s: Toejam Tweet Cherrymoon one wonders why so much energy is spent placing a blas umbrella over Serena as far as her being a large woman and their dissecting her feature to justify that shithole art image which is a visual degradation of Serena. Imo many of us americans stand in support of Serena's feeling outraged at ramos' frivously issued call minus warnings. while at this point nothing can be reversed as far as the outcome. the rules and regulations set forth by by the umpires should be consistent and equal across the board no matter the gender. (by the way osaka's coach was coaching during the also [Edited 9/20/18 16:21pm]

What has this got to do with me not seeing any racism in the cartoon? Using someone's geographical location to try and unvalidate their opinion really shows a lack of conviction (or validity perhaps?) in one's argument. Using your logic, I could have argued that you misunderstood the cartoon because you are not an Australian... In any case, there is no need to target your fellow orgers just because they have a perception of this cartoon that is different from yours.

[Edited 9/21/18 4:03am]

Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day
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Reply #211 posted 09/21/18 1:47am

CherryMoon57

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toejam said:

free2bFreeda2 said:

Imo many of us americans stand in support of Serena's feeling outraged at ramos' frivously issued call minus warnings.

.

No, Serena was given a warning for the coaching. And Ramos listened respectfully to her first outburst, and gave her plenty of time to calm down. But Serena kept going. Violently throwing your racket to the ground is, I believe, an automatic warning-less point deduction. And enough was enough when Serena continued calling Ramos a "theif" some 10 seconds or so after she insisted that he no longer speak to her. Ramos absolutely made the right calls with calm and reserve. If I were LeBron James, I'd be looking elsewhere for a role model for my daughter - at least in regards to this incident. Ramos could be used as a role model for daughter-James - teaching her how to calmly stand up to bullies who try to play victim.

[Edited 9/20/18 16:45pm]


clapping I think you've hit the nail on the head here.

Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day
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Reply #212 posted 09/21/18 2:35am

CherryMoon57

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I am neither an Australian, a right wing (I don't do politics) and far from being a white fascist but still do not see any racism in this cartoon. On the other hand, I am an active anti-bullying campaigner, well researched on that topic and I can clearly see how Serena behaves like some bullies including when she immediately tries to make people feel sorry for her after she has done something wrong. That is a typical bully behaviour.

Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day
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Reply #213 posted 09/21/18 4:33am

TweetyV6

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ThatWhiteDude said:

CherryMoon57 said:

Just because one does not see racism everywhere doesn't mean that they are a white supremacist. Sweeping generalisations and divisive mindsets can be just as dangerous as racism.

With all due respect Cherrymoon, but tweetyV6 is a racist, or why else would He send me a Video of a racist man who cried because YouTube deleted His racist video? free2bFreeda2 didn't just accuse him of being one.


Hey our SJW Snowflake keyboardwarrior has mumbled something stupid again....

You label me as racist because I sent you a link to a vid in which somebody, you also label as racist, says nothing about racism, but about SJW snowflake crybabies like you.

HEULSUSE!

The man of science has learned to believe in justification, not by faith, but by verification - Thomas Henry Huxley
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Reply #214 posted 09/21/18 4:49am

toejam

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Purplegarden said:

As a New Zealander of mixed race heritage can I just reiterate that some Australians (Well a lot mostly white and older) are very racist and have out dated views on people of colour. The country had a Whites only policy for immigration until 1966, and regarded its native Australian people (The term "Aborigine" I find racially offensive) as "Wildlife" until 1967...

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etc., etc.

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Yep. Plenty of people in Australia with racist attitudes. But none of this is actually addressing the supposed racism of the cartoon in question.

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Toejam - I disagree with you, but respect your right to your opinion and do not endorse any violent threats from our decide of the debates.

.

Thanks. Appreciated.

.

PS - is a new podcast on the books, I miss you guys!

.

We haven't gone anywhere lol Our Piano & Mic '83 review episode should be out early next week cool

Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
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Reply #215 posted 09/21/18 4:51am

toejam

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Cheers also for your encouraging words, CherryMoon57 cool

Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
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Reply #216 posted 09/21/18 4:58am

toejam

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Purplegarden said:

that cartoon is racist, she looks like an over sized peacock with lips that cover the bottom half of her face.

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Her lips are big because a) She has big features in real life - cartoonists tend to exaggerate such things, and b) it's part of the crying-baby imagery. And that outfit she wore practically demands comparisons to a peacock lol There's no need to see "racism" in this cartoon. It is not commenting on "people of colour" as a whole. It is commenting on childish behaviour by an individual.

Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
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Reply #217 posted 09/21/18 6:27am

ThatWhiteDude

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TweetyV6 said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

CherryMoon57 said: With all due respect Cherrymoon, but tweetyV6 is a racist, or why else would He send me a Video of a racist man who cried because YouTube deleted His racist video? free2bFreeda2 didn't just accuse him of being one.


Hey our SJW Snowflake keyboardwarrior has mumbled something stupid again....

You label me as racist because I sent you a link to a vid in which somebody, you also label as racist, says nothing about racism, but about SJW snowflake crybabies like you.

HEULSUSE!

This guy is a racist and the video you sent me was his reaction to YouTube for banning his racist video about muslims The title of the video YouTube banned alone was racist as fuck and you still defend this piece of shit. You maybe can fool others, but not me. And I'd be careful with stating that others (me in this case) post stupid stuff because you are the type of guy who copys whole posts out of climate change denial sites.

LOOK AT THIS FUCKING VIDEO, Here is one comment from it:

An excellent sermon, but this is like complaining about smoke, while ignoring the fire. If it were not for jewish strongarming of those politicians you mentioned, there would be no Muslim invasion to concern us. First the Jews pry their way in, then they open the door for every other brand of miscreant.


Pat is feeding the fear of people who think that the refugee crisis is a plan to replace the "european race". That man is batshit crazy and you defend this fucker. And then you got the fucking nerve to insult me as a snowflake when I point out that you are a nazi if you defend another nazi!

[Edited 9/21/18 6:34am]

[Edited 9/21/18 6:35am]

"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."


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Reply #218 posted 09/21/18 6:39am

ThatWhiteDude

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And Tweety, the only thing your insults do to me is fill me with pride, because that shows me that I am on the right side of the discussion. It would be a nightmare if you'de EVER agree with me, because then I'd be worried about my views on racism and racists.

"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."


"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker
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Reply #219 posted 09/21/18 7:38am

free2bFreeda2

toejam said:

free2bFreeda2 said:

racist mental illness running rapid in the [Australian] region.

What's your point? Are you trying to suggest the Serena cartoon or myself are racist on the basis of guilty by association of being Australian?

Come back with something substantive - like how the cartoon actually is racist - how it degrades black people as lesser people - rather than your empty appeals to the majority opinion of social media, incorrect claims about the cartoon (e.g. that Naomi is depicted white), how great a player/person Serena normally is, or attempts to change topic by posting something else. What is it about the cartoon that has you thinking it is saying something negative about black people, as opposed to it simply humorously critiquing Serena's behaviour in that moment?

.
[Edited 9/20/18 20:56pm]

Serena Williams cartoon is not ‘politically incorrect.’ It’s just racist.
excerp:
This isn’t the first time Knight’s run into this particular criticism. He also drew fire for his depiction this year of black teenagers vandalizing a train station. Maybe these caricatures are just how he views blacks generally — as violent, untamed and uncivilized “superpredators,” to borrow a truly terrible term from the 1990s.

i actually feel pity and sorrow for you. seems you lack the gumption to view the true history of your own country and it's genocide upon the indigenous australian peoples.
maybe somewhere in a twisted mindset the core of reality has been erased as a mechanism to protect people like you.
if indeed you look at the truth of the historical racist past of australia you might wake tfu and realize you are a product of the effects of racist colonizers.[img][/img]

👆
i'll bet the aussie educational system overrides the true history of the lands you walk upon.
seems a way to blind you and many others from accepting responsibility of/and accepting the fact that you may well be ingrained with
the illness of being a racist.

😨
[Edited 9/21/18 11:36am]
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Reply #220 posted 09/21/18 1:09pm

PurpleSkipper5
8

Newsflash: literally every country in the world has oppressed a group of people one way or another in the past. Doesn't mean White people or whoever should have any guilt because of what their ancestors did in the past.

”The people that will end up defining ‘Hate Speech Laws’ are the very people you don’t want to define the Hate Speech Laws” — Jordan B Peterson
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Reply #221 posted 09/21/18 1:25pm

ThatWhiteDude

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^^No, it's not our fault, nobody claims that. But white people have the responsibility to aknowledge that part of their history and to make it better, isn't it funny? We got all these history books, documentaries etc and still there are people who are blind when it comes to racism. And it's very telling that it is white people who try to tell black people that the serena comic is not racist. This is like a man telling a woman when rape is rape, taking the power away from her and then say she's just too damn sensitive. No, it's her body so stfu. As for the comic, it is racist and I can clearly see why black people feel offended.

"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."


"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker
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Reply #222 posted 09/21/18 1:43pm

CherryMoon57

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toejam said:

Cheers also for your encouraging words, CherryMoon57 cool

No worries! wink

Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day
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Reply #223 posted 09/21/18 1:53pm

toejam

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free2BFreeda said:

i actually feel pity and sorrow for you. seems you lack the gumption to view the true history of your own country and it's genocide upon the indigenous australian peoples.
maybe somewhere in a twisted mindset the core of reality has been erased as a mechanism to protect people like you.
if indeed you look at the truth of the historical racist past of australia you might wake tfu and realize you are a product of the effects of racist colonizers

.

You assume I don't know of or acknowledge Australia's shitty racist past. I do. But all of this is a DIVERSION to get around the fact you don't have anything to offer toward a positive case for why the cartoon of Serena is racist. Indeed no one in this entire thread has been able to. The closest anyone has come is to say that Serena is portrayed unflatteringly and out of proportion, and that Naomi is portrayed as white. The latter has been roundly demonstrated as false, and the former is just the reality of cartoons. That's why we keep going off on tangents about Australia's shitty racist past, pig farming, LeBron James, some unknown Tasmanian amateur football players' facebook post, Pat Condel, etc.

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You think I'm "blind" and not "woke" to Australia's shitty racist past. But I think you're the one "blind" to the reality that not all unflattering images of non-white people are racist. Serena acted like a spoiled child, so she got humorously cartooned as a child throwing a tantrum. All fair game. The cartoon is not a comment on black people as a whole, or white superiority, or whatever. You're reading that into it.

.


[Edited 9/21/18 16:18pm]

Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
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Reply #224 posted 09/21/18 3:56pm

EmmaMcG

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ThatWhiteDude said:

^^No, it's not our fault, nobody claims that. But white people have the responsibility to aknowledge that part of their history and to make it better, isn't it funny? We got all these history books, documentaries etc and still there are people who are blind when it comes to racism. And it's very telling that it is white people who try to tell black people that the serena comic is not racist. This is like a man telling a woman when rape is rape, taking the power away from her and then say she's just too damn sensitive. No, it's her body so stfu. As for the comic, it is racist and I can clearly see why black people feel offended.





I don't want to join the debate about whether or not the drawing is racist, but for what it's worth, not every black person sees it as being so. A former colleague of mine said she thought it was "hilarious" and my ex boyfriend found it neither funny nor offensive. In fact, he was more bothered about Serena's attitude on the court than the drawing of her. He is, after all, a big fan of hers and felt ashamed to admit that after her behaviour.

Personally, I don't think we can say definitively whether the drawing was racist or not because its only a drawing. We'd have to know the thought process of the artist who drew it. Was it his intent to degrade all black people or was he merely exaggerating one person's physical features? I don't know. And when it comes to matters of racism, I believe intent is everything. Therefore I would not be comfortable with passing judgment one way or the other.
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Reply #225 posted 09/23/18 4:35am

TweetyV6

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ThatWhiteDude said:

And Tweety, the only thing your insults do to me is fill me with pride, because that shows me that I am on the right side of the discussion. It would be a nightmare if you'de EVER agree with me, because then I'd be worried about my views on racism and racists.

Hey!
Use your brain. Which forum is this? A typical hangout for racists and nazi's, hm? A forum dedicated to a black artist.
I was listening to music mainly from black artists when you were stil fluid, dangling in your daddys nutsack.
I have plenty of friends of colour, straight & gay.

What I have a strong aversion against, though, is people like you and free2bfreeda2 labeling people with an oposite opinion as racist and nazi and talking about whit supremacy, trying to put some kind of gult on my shoulder because I'm white. Who's the racists there?

You just scream but if you're asked (now for the 5th time) what should happen (with the cartoon(ist)) to make you feel better (because being offended is no more then a personal feeling), you don't respond. You duck and run.

The man of science has learned to believe in justification, not by faith, but by verification - Thomas Henry Huxley
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Reply #226 posted 09/23/18 12:05pm

2freaky4church
1

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Toejam is digging.

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #227 posted 09/23/18 2:20pm

toejam

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2freaky4church1 said:

Toejam is digging.

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Am I?

.

So far, your only responses to me have been "Toejam, Alice Springs", and something implying that I have an ethic to win "at all costs".

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You said the cartoon is "super racist". Can you coherently explain why? Or are you just going to resort to further topic switching and accusations against my character?

.

Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
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Reply #228 posted 09/23/18 4:24pm

ThatWhiteDude

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TweetyV6 said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

And Tweety, the only thing your insults do to me is fill me with pride, because that shows me that I am on the right side of the discussion. It would be a nightmare if you'de EVER agree with me, because then I'd be worried about my views on racism and racists.

Hey!
Use your brain. Which forum is this? A typical hangout for racists and nazi's, hm? A forum dedicated to a black artist.
I was listening to music mainly from black artists when you were stil fluid, dangling in your daddys nutsack.
I have plenty of friends of colour, straight & gay.

What I have a strong aversion against, though, is people like you and free2bfreeda2 labeling people with an oposite opinion as racist and nazi and talking about whit supremacy, trying to put some kind of gult on my shoulder because I'm white. Who's the racists there?

You just scream but if you're asked (now for the 5th time) what should happen (with the cartoon(ist)) to make you feel better (because being offended is no more then a personal feeling), you don't respond. You duck and run.

Nothing should happend to make ME feel better, something should happen to make black people feel better. You know how I see it? It seems like that some white people think: "Look, black people are allowed to be in the same shop, they are allowed to use the same bathrooms as whites etc, etc. so why are they still complaining?" Racism doesn't always have to be ovious at the first look, it is the same with the cartoon, most white people wouldn't see it as racist. And it's not only me or free2bFreeda2 or others on this forum here, it's also news papers such as The Washington Post who explain why the fucking cartoon is racist.

And you honestly don't get why I called you a racist, you're the only user here I ever called a racist and that is because YOU posted videos of Pat Condell and this Dude is a racist and you agree with him even when he's clearly degrading muslims.

You know, I don't agree with what the terrorists did with the Charlie Hebdo thing. But it wasn't only radicals who were offended by the caricature, I had a lot of muslim friends on FB who were pissed, because they take their religion serious and they have the right to be offended and if you don't see the difference on how they portray Jesus vs how they portray mohammed then you're clearly blind. Islam has always been mocked by the western culture. If we chose to mock Jesus, then that's okay, but the western people simply have no respect for other cultures, religions, black people, brown people. And if someone calls them out on it, they say: "Freedom of speech, it's just a caricature etc." It's like some comedians who say: "It's just a joke", just to have an excuse for their prejudice, it is the same.

And I just don't think it's okay to say, as a white person: "It's not racist." It's like a man who dictates to a woman what is rape and what is not, that's not how it works.

Oh and for the record Tweety, just because you have friends who are black or listen to black artists, doesn't mean you're not racist LOL. There was a discussion about that subject in another thread, you should look that up man!

Do you also have muslim friends?? What's their opinion on these Pat Condell videos? If you tell me that they agree with him then they are literal dumbfucks, like a bone running to a dog, just saying.

Oh and before forget it, here's an article on why the cartoon is racist:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/comic-riffs/wp/2018/09/10/an-australian-artists-racist-serena-williams-cartoon-receives-swift-and-international-blowback/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.ee27da228b01

"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."


"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker
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Reply #229 posted 09/23/18 4:26pm

ThatWhiteDude

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EmmaMcG said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

^^No, it's not our fault, nobody claims that. But white people have the responsibility to aknowledge that part of their history and to make it better, isn't it funny? We got all these history books, documentaries etc and still there are people who are blind when it comes to racism. And it's very telling that it is white people who try to tell black people that the serena comic is not racist. This is like a man telling a woman when rape is rape, taking the power away from her and then say she's just too damn sensitive. No, it's her body so stfu. As for the comic, it is racist and I can clearly see why black people feel offended.

I don't want to join the debate about whether or not the drawing is racist, but for what it's worth, not every black person sees it as being so. A former colleague of mine said she thought it was "hilarious" and my ex boyfriend found it neither funny nor offensive. In fact, he was more bothered about Serena's attitude on the court than the drawing of her. He is, after all, a big fan of hers and felt ashamed to admit that after her behaviour. Personally, I don't think we can say definitively whether the drawing was racist or not because its only a drawing. We'd have to know the thought process of the artist who drew it. Was it his intent to degrade all black people or was he merely exaggerating one person's physical features? I don't know. And when it comes to matters of racism, I believe intent is everything. Therefore I would not be comfortable with passing judgment one way or the other.

I linked an article in my answer to Tweety where they said that this wasn't the first time the cartoonist was under fire for the way he portrays black people.

"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."


"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker
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Reply #230 posted 09/23/18 8:54pm

Goddess4Real

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Serena Williams in her first interview since her dramatic US Open meltdown on The Project Sunday 23/09/18

Keep Calm & Listen To Prince
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Reply #231 posted 09/23/18 8:54pm

PurpleSkipper5
8

”The people that will end up defining ‘Hate Speech Laws’ are the very people you don’t want to define the Hate Speech Laws” — Jordan B Peterson
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Reply #232 posted 09/23/18 9:04pm

PurpleSkipper5
8

Features our girl Serena!

”The people that will end up defining ‘Hate Speech Laws’ are the very people you don’t want to define the Hate Speech Laws” — Jordan B Peterson
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Reply #233 posted 09/23/18 9:13pm

Goddess4Real

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2freaky4church1 said:

I have always had a sex thing with Serena but she is in the wrong with her childish tirade. It was not sexist it was just. She broke her racket, called the ref names. She was being a baby and what happened was deserved. Don't forget the other player was a woman of color.

The cartoon, on the other hand was racist bs. Serena, retire and let someone else win.

If anyone is to blame, its Serena's coach. I felt so sorry for Naomi sad because she didn't get her chance to bask in her victory. However, this interview she with did recently with Ellen was awesome worship I wish her all the best clapping

Here is Michael B. Jordan's reply, that was so sweet of him to do nod

[Edited 9/23/18 21:19pm]

Keep Calm & Listen To Prince
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Reply #234 posted 09/23/18 10:59pm

TweetyV6

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ThatWhiteDude said:

Nothing should happend to make ME feel better, something should happen to make black people feel better. You know how I see it? It seems like that some white people think: "Look, black people are allowed to be in the same shop, they are allowed to use the same bathrooms as whites etc, etc. so why are they still complaining?"


As I said. You're a Social Justice Warrior Snowflake. A cry baby getting upset about a cartoon, Act offended in the name of people, who probably haven't even asked for being 'represented' by you. Just to show your Polictical Corectness (or Gutmenschlichkeit) and your 'moral superiority'.

ThatWhiteDude said:


Racism doesn't always have to be ovious at the first look, it is the same with the cartoon, most white people wouldn't see it as racist. And it's not only me or free2bFreeda2 or others on this forum here, it's also news papers such as The Washington Post who explain why the fucking cartoon is racist.


Ah, yes... the WaPo. Can you get any more political correct?
Ask me if I care about their opinion..... I suppose you know the answer. I decide for myself, I don't need explanation by others.

And you honestly don't get why I called you a racist, you're the only user here I ever called a racist and that is because YOU posted videos of Pat Condell and this Dude is a racist and you agree with him even when he's clearly degrading muslims.


I posted 1 (One!) video by Condell. It was regarding SJW Snoflakes. Not about muslims or any other topic. So don't stretch the playfield to make your point, Dude.


You know, I don't agree with what the terrorists did with the Charlie Hebdo thing. But it wasn't only radicals who were offended by the caricature, I had a lot of muslim friends on FB who were pissed, because they take their religion serious and they have the right to be offended and if you don't see the difference on how they portray Jesus vs how they portray mohammed then you're clearly blind. Islam has always been mocked by the western culture. If we chose to mock Jesus, then that's okay, but the western people simply have no respect for other cultures, religions,


I despise ANY religion. It's for idiots. And it's fine if they practice it at home or in their chosen church/synagoge/temple/mosk. But don't put it in my face or try to influence/dictate how I have to behave.
Respect is something you have to earn. Not something you get naturally.

black people, brown people. And if someone calls them out on it, they say: "Freedom of speech, it's just a caricature etc." It's like some comedians who say: "It's just a joke", just to have an excuse for their prejudice, it is the same.

Wow, wow, friend, don't connect race to religion.
And yes IT IS FREEDOM OF SPEECH. If someone can't handle what is said it's THEIR problem.
You ALWAYS have the choice to ignore it.
It is sad to hear Dutch comedians say that they will not make any jokes about islam because the are afraid to get hurt or killed.

And Helper Whitey's like you are, are part of that problem.

And I just don't think it's okay to say, as a white person: "It's not racist." It's like a man who dictates to a woman what is rape and what is not, that's not how it works.


Oh, but it's okay for you to dictate others what it is? GTFO!
And don't compare apples & oranges here. Rape is in a very other category then a as racist percieved cartoon.

Oh and for the record Tweety, just because you have friends who are black or listen to black artists, doesn't mean you're not racist LOL. There was a discussion about that subject in another thread, you should look that up man!


Again. Your OPINION. Not mine.

Do you also have muslim friends?? What's their opinion on these Pat Condell videos? If you tell me that they agree with him then they are literal dumbfucks, like a bone running to a dog, just saying.


Ask me if I care what they think.
We have our differences, but we respect that.

Oh and before forget it, here's an article on why the cartoon is racist:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/comic-riffs/wp/2018/09/10/an-australian-artists-racist-serena-williams-cartoon-receives-swift-and-international-blowback/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.ee27da228b01

Don't bother. Will not read anyway.

The man of science has learned to believe in justification, not by faith, but by verification - Thomas Henry Huxley
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Reply #235 posted 09/24/18 12:51am

toejam

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The Washington Post article by Michael Cavna is not very persuasive in making the case that the cartoon is racist. Cavna tries to make the argument with the following points:

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Knight depicts the 23-time Grand Slam champion as a pacifier-sucking young child throwing a tantrum. The umpire says to eventual champion Naomi Osaka: “Can you just let her win?” In doing so, Knight draws facial features reflecting the dehumanizing Jim Crow caricatures so common in the 19th and 20th centuries. Knight’s cartoon conjures up a range of such caricatures that were branded on memorabilia and popularized on stage and screen of the era...

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Cavna acknowledges that Serena is depicted in a way that is supposed to remind one of a child throwing a tantrum. Serena has big features in real life. These factors alone explains her unflattering depiction. It's an apt metaphor. Serena acted like a child throwing a tantrum, so she is portrayed as a child throwing a tantrum - spitting out a dummy, stomping her feet, and crying with a wide open mouth and crocodile tears. It is not supposed to be a comment on black people being inferior to non-blacks. Any perceived "conjuring" of Jim Crow-era features need not be intended or necessary and I suspect is brought to the image by those prone to see "racism" where it's not actually there.

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Knight’s sendup of that match is being criticized for how he caricatured both finalists. His Osaka figure — given her light skin, thin frame and entirely blond hair — looks like a small white woman, some critics say...

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Note the way Cavna doesn't personally commit himself to this point, carefully inserting that it's what "some critics say". I suspect he doesn't commit because he knows it's not all that strong. I have already demonstrated in this thread that Naomi is not portrayed as a "small white woman". Her skin tone is depicted significantly darker than the "white" chair umpire. Just about every colour in the cartoon - from skin tones, to clothes, to the sea of crowd, to Serena's green racket, to the blue court - are lighter than they were in real life. Naomi is "small" because she is in the background. Indeed, with perspective taken into account, she's actually taller than she probably would be in real life! She is not a "faceless prop" (to quote Cavna's reputable source, celebrity children's author J.K. Rowling's twitter comment). The point of Naomi being in the background is more likely to say that her gallant victory has been unfairly overshadowed by the tantrum-throwing Serena. This has nothing to do with gender or race. It has everything to do with Serena's poor behaviour.

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In early August, for a cartoon about train-safety in the Australian state of Victoria, Knight also faced ire for how he drew faceless black figures fighting in the background

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The cartoon in question was commenting on a series of actual incidents involving African gangs in Victorian train stations. The major TARGET of the cartoon, the one being lampooned, was a white politician and her (perceived) weak handling of the situation. This also strikes me as Cavna cherry-picking Knight's cartoons to suit his argument and ignoring others that go against it. For example, Cavna failed to mention Knight's recent cartoon that positively depicted "person of colour" Aretha Franklin upon her passing, nor his cartoon from only a few days before the now infamous Serena one that also depicted an Australian tennis star, male non-African Nick Kyrgios, as a child-like brat for his poor behaviour on the tennis court. By not mentioning such cartoons, Cavna's audience misses out on an awful lot of information needed to put the Serena cartoon in its proper context.

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[Edited 9/24/18 1:34am]

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Reply #236 posted 09/24/18 3:03am

ThatWhiteDude

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Tweety the only arguments you have are:

They didn't ask you to talk for them - I don't talk for them, but it seems like you have a problem with white people who call people out on their racism, you don't have to be black to be against racism and just because I am against racism doesn't mean I talk for all black people, this is ridiculous.

I don't care - Yes, that's often your answer when it comes to racism, yes you don't care because racism doesn't effect you, right?

Justice Warrior/Snowflake - You to go argument whenever people (especially me) speak up against racism

Free Speech - Funny that I only ever heard that from nazis when people called them out for being racist LOL. I've never heard a normal person say: "Free Speech", because they didn't get called out for being racists, homophobic or whatever.

You arguments for the Pat Video - I told a fucking 100 times that he cries in this specific video about YouTube because they deleted his racist video a couple of days earlier. He calls them SJW because he can't accept that people don't tolerate hate speech anymore. You're either too dumb to understand why he made the video you posted (Even tho I said why he did it) Or you simply chose to ignore it just so it fits your own narrative.

Oh and if you're offended because I said you're probably dumb, well, I suppose your rules apply here: Free Speech, Snowflake.

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Reply #237 posted 09/24/18 4:32am

TweetyV6

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ThatWhiteDude said:

Tweety the only arguments you have are:

They didn't ask you to talk for them - I don't talk for them, but it seems like you have a problem with white people who call people out on their racism, you don't have to be black to be against racism and just because I am against racism doesn't mean I talk for all black people, this is ridiculous.

I don't care - Yes, that's often your answer when it comes to racism, yes you don't care because racism doesn't effect you, right?

Justice Warrior/Snowflake - You to go argument whenever people (especially me) speak up against racism

Free Speech - Funny that I only ever heard that from nazis when people called them out for being racist LOL. I've never heard a normal person say: "Free Speech", because they didn't get called out for being racists, homophobic or whatever.

You arguments for the Pat Video - I told a fucking 100 times that he cries in this specific video about YouTube because they deleted his racist video a couple of days earlier. He calls them SJW because he can't accept that people don't tolerate hate speech anymore. You're either too dumb to understand why he made the video you posted (Even tho I said why he did it) Or you simply chose to ignore it just so it fits your own narrative.

Oh and if you're offended because I said you're probably dumb, well, I suppose your rules apply here: Free Speech, Snowflake.


Dude. You're the one labeling me racist by proxy. Oh wait, even Nazi. Who's dumb here?
Have you ever seen me approve racism? I mean REAL racism, not percieved racism in a cartoon.

As a kid, I have been subject to a kind of racism (since belonging to a certain nationality nowadays is being labeled racism too) I'd rather call it bullied.
I have been (severely) beaten, spit on and made fun of in the period I was 6-12yrs old. It stoped when I outgrew my class mates (I was in puberty early, had to shave when I was 13) and switched to high school when I was 13.
I decided for myself not to be offended anymore about what was said about me, or my kind. That made life much easier.

Oh and regarding you calling me dumb... see you at our next Mensa meeting? Or rather not?
The 2nd, I guess.

The man of science has learned to believe in justification, not by faith, but by verification - Thomas Henry Huxley
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Reply #238 posted 09/24/18 4:38am

TweetyV6

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ThatWhiteDude said:

I don't talk for them


And yet you do.

The man of science has learned to believe in justification, not by faith, but by verification - Thomas Henry Huxley
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Reply #239 posted 09/24/18 4:39am

ThatWhiteDude

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TweetyV6 said:



ThatWhiteDude said:


Tweety the only arguments you have are:



They didn't ask you to talk for them - I don't talk for them, but it seems like you have a problem with white people who call people out on their racism, you don't have to be black to be against racism and just because I am against racism doesn't mean I talk for all black people, this is ridiculous.




I don't care - Yes, that's often your answer when it comes to racism, yes you don't care because racism doesn't effect you, right?




Justice Warrior/Snowflake - You to go argument whenever people (especially me) speak up against racism




Free Speech - Funny that I only ever heard that from nazis when people called them out for being racist LOL. I've never heard a normal person say: "Free Speech", because they didn't get called out for being racists, homophobic or whatever.




You arguments for the Pat Video - I told a fucking 100 times that he cries in this specific video about YouTube because they deleted his racist video a couple of days earlier. He calls them SJW because he can't accept that people don't tolerate hate speech anymore. You're either too dumb to understand why he made the video you posted (Even tho I said why he did it) Or you simply chose to ignore it just so it fits your own narrative.




Oh and if you're offended because I said you're probably dumb, well, I suppose your rules apply here: Free Speech, Snowflake.




Dude. You're the one labeling me racist by proxy. Oh wait, even Nazi. Who's dumb here?
Have you ever seen me approve racism? I mean REAL racism, not percieved racism in a cartoon.

As a kid, I have been subject to a kind of racism (since belonging to a certain nationality nowadays is being labeled racism too) I'd rather call it bullied.
I have been (severely) beaten, spit on and made fun of in the period I was 6-12yrs old. It stoped when I outgrew my class mates (I was in puberty early, had to shave when I was 13) and switched to high school when I was 13.
I decided for myself not to be offended anymore about what was said about me, or my kind. That made life much easier.

Oh and regarding you calling me dumb... see you at our next Mensa meeting? Or rather not?
The 2nd, I guess.


bored bored bored
"Like books and BLACK LIVES, Albums still MATTER."


"Extra cheese, extra HAM, extra bullshit" -DiminutiveRocker
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